Wladamir Klitshko Vs Lennox Lewis

HOW sad that the fight that the haters hold onto the most was almost 6 years ago....hell some boxers dont even have a career that long

SAD....SAD.....SAD

 

I didn't start this....how long ago was Lewis V VITLAY?

Let it go already

 

Fudging is what we all do on these threads, happy new year to you too Klit-ite :happy

 

1) Ali's co-trainer Drew Brown said they bribed cooks to drug ("poison") Foreman for the fight. Can you imagine Sdunek (Wlad's co-trainer) saying that they paid someone to poison Byrd before the fight? Ridiculous.

2) Frazier _IS_ half-blind. He cannot see with his left eye.

3) Liston claimed he made a dive because he feared retaliation from Ali's Muslim friends (Islamic terrorism). If Liston didn't make a dive, but just CLAIMS it then he is a liar and/or a quitter. Choose the Liston whom Ali beat: The liar, the quitter or the diver.

If you are shot don't fight, or the fight will be counted for your record.

Moreover I believe that his Parkinson was caused by his lack of defense (= too many wars). Thus being "shot" is merely a proof of his non-domination of opponents.

I take it as a proof that Ali is overrated, you take "being shot" as an excuse.

My god, Liston (6'0.5'') has a completely bummed-up record.
See my post at http://www.eastsideboxing.com/forum/showthread.php?t=114202&page=3

Frazier (even smaller than Liston 5'11.5'') belongs there where Foreman put him. That Ali had so much difficulties with Frazier just shows how limited Ali was, not how good Frazier was. It's the typical moebius mind melt of Ali fans "Wow, Ali is great"... "Why?"... "He beat Frazier"... "So?"... "Don't you know who Frazier is? He beat Ali!"

Foreman (6'3'', 220 lbs) was Ali's biggest win. Drugging aside, some of the largest part of Ali's greatness is that he beat Foreman and that he was lucky enough there was no rematch. I don't think Foreman would have gassed a second time.

Sure, since he clinches instantly, grabs his opponents head and insults him.... or runs away.

I already wrote that one should watch Ali vs Norton. Ali does not see any jab coming. Even the slowest jabs. He would eat more jabs than Rahman in the Klitschko fight.

Remember, Klitschko vs Eliseo Castillo? That small guy (Castillo) was also a natural cruiser like Ali and just a little bit lighter than Ali (in the Foreman fight).

Klitschko would be Ali's HEAVIEST opponent (aside from fatty Buster Mathis). Klitschko would be Ali's TALLEST opponent. Ali would be amongst the LIGHTEST of Klitschko's opponents.

I think featherfisty Ali would be able to dominate powerjabbing Klitschko.... if they manage to bribe another cook.

But you see, EVERYONE can claim that anyone else is making a **** out of himself. This forum is FULL of replies like "Fail" and "Worst post ever".
I am at least backing up my claims by actually WATCHING the fights and by ANALYZING how Ali actually PERFORMED against WHAT KIND opponents.

Everyone can lipsync with Ali that he was the greatest. But as Foreman said, Ali was just the greatest talker.

I never stated anything of that sort. It just so happens that Klitschko has one of the best records in heavyweight history. But obviously being a Klitschko fan is already enough for you to discredit someone.

 

See you actually made a lot of sense in the first part of the post and I can agree with most of it and forgive WALDO for that loss when it's put like that and you'll ALWAYS see me give both Klits credit for at least bothering to turn up for fights in shape and prepared unlike the Peters and Toneys of this world. If only certain Klit-ites would admit that Lewis made the same mistakes in his losses then we might just get along a bit better.

That last sentence though...it's meaningless. Lewis might have said that to Sanders, I don't know. Even if he did say it I'd take it with a pinch of salt, the man is hardly likely to say "**** I'd have beaten the **** out of you if we'd ever fought" is he? Remember Tyson saying "if he'd been at his best I couldn't have stood a chance" about Holmes? Think he meant it? No, I don't either.

 

Oh **** that's riddled with bull**** from start to finish. Believing a word that Bundini Brown ever said switched me off from the rest of it, you do know the history of that guy, right? atsch

 

Holy **** this is a long ass thread thats been beaten to death. We've been talking about this for years on ESB. Does it ever get old?

Anyway, like I've always said, I strongly believe that Lewis wins by stoppage. It would be a tough fight while it lasted but I think that Lewis has too many offensive tools.

He'd win the fight on the outside forcing Wlad to have to come in where frankly, Lewis completely outclasses him on infighting skills. Wlads uppercuts are complete ****. Lewis lands uppercuts on the inside for a KO. It would be close for awhile because Wlad has good outside range offense but I do think that Lewis would eventually force him to come in and win.

 

Well, ok. Thanks, I guess.

 

Agreed in the first part. If you have read my posts before... you will see that I basically think Wlad and Lewis lost for the same reasons in their career. With the sort of size and talent that they possess, it would be very easy to become complacent. Which is why they never lost against the best fighters that they fought. They lost to guys that basically nobody felt would be competitive against them. Makes sense, right?

As for the second part, I just wondered what you felt about that. It really doesn't go with what else you were saying though... because Lewis didn't have to tell him anything like that. Sanders had actually been going after that fight for a long time. I don't blame Lewis for avoiding that fight. Not because Sanders is a better fighter, but because he is so damn dangerous, and he is clearly NOT a better fighter. Those are the toughest opponents to face. Hard to get up for, little reward for winning, yet a huge risk.

 

But Brown has not the only say in this.

These are Foreman's words, and I don't believe he is a liar. I actually also don't believe that Ali personally wanted Foreman poisoned. But there is a possibility that it really happened.

"I said, 'This water tastes like it has medicine in it'," Foreman told trainer Dick Sadler before the fight. The fighter said Sadler assured him it was fine.
"I know there was medicine in that water. I'll never forget that.
...

"It was years before I got my health back together after that fight," Foreman said.
"It wasn't doctors who put something in my water. They didn't have PhDs. I'm lucky I'm still alive."

 

I'm with you on this. Foreman was drugged. Ali had nothing to do with it.
The fight was really easy for him.

 

First part, fair enough we seem to have found some common ground there. That doesn't mean I think old WALDO would beat Lewis though :twisted:

The second thing.....well I just think Lewis was being kind, fighters tend to do that after the fact and I could list numerous examples of it. I don't recall Sanders ever going after Lewis but I've no doubt he did, of course he did - Lewis was the champion after all. Doesn't mean he'd have won but I'll happily concede he'd have had as much chance as Rahman did all those years ago. What I refuse to concede is that an old Sanders that fought WALDO was as dangerous as the one that Lewis would have faced years earlier though, the natural ageing process took care of that and he still managed to flatten WALDO. WALDO may have gotten better since then, may have gotten worse, depends on your stance.

This is not to say that WALDO can't go on to create a great legacy in the upcoming years - he'll never be as good as Lewis was in my eyes and maybe there's home-town bias in that, maybe not. What I do give the guy credit for as I said before is that he always shows up in shape and ready to fight and he is pretty active compared to recent heavyweight champions. I like the guy as a human being and even if he doesn't cement a great legacy I hope he leaves the sport in good shape, happy and wealthy.

I can't say fairer than that, even as a known hater surely?

Have a great 2009 :good

 

Yo u guys are not drunk enough... atsch

 

:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl

Absolute bull****. So now you're suggesting that Foremans own trainer was in on it? Of course he was, it was in his best interests for his fighter to lose, right :nut

Foreman made excuses left right and center after that fight but the fact is he was beaten by the better fighter. I think maybe there should have been a rematch but Ali was getting older by then and I don't blame him for not taking one. Having said that the Ali that fought Frazier in Manilla in 1975 would have ****ed Foreman up too.

Those of us that know the game though, will look back at the Ali of 1965-1967 as the very best heavyweight that ever drew breath, and for good reason. What he did after 1973 was just gravy.

 

You too.

The only thing that we disagree on is that I feel Sanders being older and less active made him MORE dangerous to Wlad. For simple reason that Wlad never took him seriously. Had it been a younger, more active Sanders... Wlad would have been ready for a real fight. I know it sounds ******ed, but that's what I think.

Obviously we never agree on your stance towards Wlad, but that's besides the point.