Wladimir Klitschko Vs. The ATG's: Their Opponent's Total Combined Wins and Losses.

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by CST80, Nov 23, 2014.


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  1. CST80

    CST80 De Omnibus Dubitandum Staff Member

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    The Combined Losses of the ATG's Opponents
    This isn't 100% perfect, it might be slightly high by 10 to 15 because I counted rematches, but its pretty close.

    Foreman's opponents had a combined total of
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    losses in 81 matches.
    Frazier's opponents had a combined total of
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    losses in 36 matches.
    Holmes' opponents had a combined total of
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    losses in 75 matches.
    Liston's opponents had a combined total of
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    losses in 54 matches.
    Louis' opponents had a combined total of
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    losses in 69 matches.GOAT:rofl
    Marciano's opponents had a combined total of
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    losses in 49 matches.
    Lennox's opponents had a combined total of
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    losses in 43 matches.
    Ali's opponents had a combined total of
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    losses in 61 matches.

    (*Ali fought Spinks twice, Norton 3 times, Frazier 3 times, Liston 2 times Chuvalo 2 times, Quarry 2 times, Patterson 2 times, Cooper 2 times, Bugner 2 times lowering his opponents loss records, that an awful lot of rematches.:D)


    Wladimir's opponents had a combined total of
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    losses in 66 matches, if you eliminate 2 of his early opponents Speight and Young it drops to 288.

    Its hard to quantify how good the competition was from era to era, but this may give a little insight.

    Average Loss Percentage All Matches
    4.9% Ali*
    5.1% Holmes
    5.3% Wlad
    5.3% Lennox
    5.4% Frazier
    7.7% Foreman
    9.0% Liston
    10.3% Louis
    10.5% Marciano


    Adjusted Only Counting Wins
    5.3% Ali*
    5.5% Holmes
    5.5% Wlad
    5.6% Lennox
    6.1% Frazier
    8.2% Foreman
    8.9% Liston
    10.3% Louis
    10.5% Marciano



    Combined Wins of the ATG's Opponents
    Foreman's opponents had a combined total of
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    wins
    Frazier's opponents had a combined total of
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    wins
    Holmes' opponents had a combined total of
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    wins
    Liston's opponents had a combined total of
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    wins
    Louis' opponents had a combined total of
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    wins
    Marciano's opponents had a combined total of
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    wins
    Lennox's opponents had a combined total of
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    wins
    Ali's opponents had a combined total of
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    wins (if you eliminate Archie Moore it drops to 1503)
    Wladimir's opponents had a combined total of
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    wins (that's a lot of wins for "losers")

    Average Opponent Win Percentage
    Louis 38.01% ***
    Ali 30.12%
    Marciano 27.9%
    Lennox 25.4%
    Wlad 25.3 %
    Frazier 23.1%
    Holmes 20.5%
    Foreman 20.8%
    Liston 18.2%

    (Louis' opponents also had the most Losses as well)



    A Little Food for Thought:think
     
    CST80, Nov 23, 2014
    CST80, Nov 23, 2014
    #1
  2. CST80

    CST80 De Omnibus Dubitandum Staff Member

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    I know its a hard pill to swallow a gigantic Ukrainian non-American who been stopped 3 times, with a dull (for some strange reason the same people who like Floyd and Rigo don't like a defensive master like Wlad) is inching closer and closer to being the GOAT
     
    CST80, Nov 23, 2014
    CST80, Nov 23, 2014
    #2
  3. Asterion

    Asterion Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Wlad is greater than Marciano and Liston, clearly.

    I rank him right now #6 of all time.
     
    Asterion, Nov 23, 2014
    Asterion, Nov 23, 2014
    #3
  4. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

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    These numbers, by themselves, don't really mean a whole lot. Do they?
     
    Rumsfeld, Nov 23, 2014
    Rumsfeld, Nov 23, 2014
    #4
  5. CST80

    CST80 De Omnibus Dubitandum Staff Member

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    The ATG's fought a lot and I mean A LOT of bums, and Wlad's while not a whole hell of alot better, they're not any worse. And if he stays around for another 10 years like he claims, I can't see him fighting a bunch of bums with 45 losses from here on out.
    We are witnessing history Wlad will be the GOAT..... Enjoy it.:party
     
    CST80, Nov 23, 2014
    CST80, Nov 23, 2014
    #5
  6. Lopetego

    Lopetego Guest

    when/where did he say that?

    and yeah, Wlad's on his way to be the HW GOAT

    It's a shame Vitali's multiple injuries and brotherly bond prevented him from achieving that position, Vitali could have beaten anyone Wlad has ever beaten, those Wlad couldn't beat, and Wlad himself if the circumstances had been different.
     
    Lopetego, Nov 23, 2014
    Lopetego, Nov 23, 2014
    #6
  7. CST80

    CST80 De Omnibus Dubitandum Staff Member

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    http://4csportsmedia.sportsblog.com/post/506112
     
    CST80, Nov 23, 2014
    CST80, Nov 23, 2014
    #7
  8. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

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    So you are of the impression that the GOAT is something objective rather than subjective, and that it can be computed mathematically?
     
    Rumsfeld, Nov 23, 2014
    Rumsfeld, Nov 23, 2014
    #8
  9. CST80

    CST80 De Omnibus Dubitandum Staff Member

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    Versus what? Media hyped "greatness"? Everything can be looked at subjectively and objectively and everyone will come to differing conclusions. No one will ever agree who the GOAT truly is, but from a mathematical perspective Wlad is closing in to being at the forefront of the conversation, as much as that may bother some people, its becoming a reality.
     
    CST80, Nov 23, 2014
    CST80, Nov 23, 2014
    #9
  10. Lopetego

    Lopetego Guest

    Lopetego, Nov 23, 2014
    Lopetego, Nov 23, 2014
    #10
  11. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

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    You never answered my question.

    :smoke
     
    Rumsfeld, Nov 23, 2014
    Rumsfeld, Nov 23, 2014
    #11
  12. AnotherFan

    AnotherFan Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Are there any solid reason to why this solution should not be tried out?
     
    AnotherFan, Nov 23, 2014
    AnotherFan, Nov 23, 2014
    #12
  13. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

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    What should be tried, exactly?

    What mathematical formula should be used, for starters?
     
    Rumsfeld, Nov 23, 2014
    Rumsfeld, Nov 23, 2014
    #13
  14. LightsOutJack

    LightsOutJack Well-Known Member Full Member

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    So are we not gonna talk about the weak era? Or are we still claiming this is actually one of the strongest eras of all time, like only Europeans seem to think... At least Joe Louis never looked like a sloppy mongoloid when he was knocking bums out
     
    LightsOutJack, Nov 24, 2014
    LightsOutJack, Nov 24, 2014
    #14
  15. RememberingC.S.

    RememberingC.S. Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Thanks! Statistics like those are severely underrated in my opinion. I've dreamed of a software able to, after being inputed with all the inputs of the data of all the known boxers ever, to calculate who has, for example, the least average losses, the average tougher opponents, etc. etc.

    Granted, it couldn't be flawless and some of the results would be.... bizarre to say the least, but it would be extremely interesting and could give precious helps in valuating a boxer.

    By any chance, do you happen to have calculated Wlad's average opponent height and weight? Those are two very important datas, and one day i'll crawl boxrec to calculate it by myself, but if you already have done it...
     
    RememberingC.S., Nov 24, 2014
    RememberingC.S., Nov 24, 2014
    #15
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