Worst Styles for ATGs?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by George Crowcroft, Oct 12, 2019.


  1. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft The Cincinnati Cobra Full Member

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    Basically who are the worst stylistic nightmares for a list of ATGs of your choice. A few examples.

    Arguello is a horrendous match up for Pacquiao.
    Benitez is a horrendous match up for Chavez.
    Foreman is a horrendous match up for Tyson.
    Hearns is a horrendous match up for Armstrong.
    Greb is a horrendous match up for Hopkins.

    Although these were fairly obvious, are there any obscure ones you can come up with?
     
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  2. roughdiamond

    roughdiamond Bebop Boxer Full Member

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    Canto loses to Park / Harada / Chang. Awful for him. He also has massive trouble with Zapata and Ohba. Yet Canto is greater than all of them save Harada, and the most skilled.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2019
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  3. BCS8

    BCS8 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Hearns is a horrendous matchup for Floyd too.
     
  4. roughdiamond

    roughdiamond Bebop Boxer Full Member

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    Here's one.

    Joey Giardello is a nightmare style for Canelo (if you think he'll be an Atg).
     
  5. dinovelvet

    dinovelvet Antifanboi Full Member

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    Always thought Mike was a bad match-up for Louis. I reckon Joe would get Spink'd.
     
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  6. Brixton Bomber

    Brixton Bomber Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Hearns for Mayweather is the worst stylistic match-up I can think of. Many think so, too.

    Foreman/Tyson? Never did get that one. Tyson wouldn't at all be afraid of him.
     
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  7. red cobra

    red cobra Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Joey would have been his boss, especially back in the 15 round days.
     
  8. red cobra

    red cobra Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I'd like to make it clear though, Joey Giardello did not need a 15 round match to defeat Canelo...he would beat the red headed joker in a 10 rounder just as well.
     
  9. Fergy

    Fergy Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Chris Byrd for Foreman and Tyson. I honestly think he'd pull of an upset over one of them at least.
     
  10. Bronze Tiger

    Bronze Tiger Active Member Full Member

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    Floyd is a nightmare for Alexis Arguello
     
  11. Bronze Tiger

    Bronze Tiger Active Member Full Member

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    Im gonna get killed for this one...but Iran Barkley would give Sugar Ray Robinson some problems
     
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  12. The Undefeated Lachbuster

    The Undefeated Lachbuster Idealism must not be staunched by safety Full Member

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    Foreman is a horrendous matchup for Marciano

    Marciano is a horrendous matchup for Louis and Ali

    Armstrong is a horrendous matchup for Jofre

    Dempsey is a horrendous matchup for Wladimir

    Foster is a horrendous matchup for Greb

    Armstrong is a horrendous matchup for Mayweather

    Leonard is a horrendous matchup for Mayweather

    Mayweather is a horrendous matchup for Whitaker

    Duran is a horrendous matchup for JCC
     
  13. greynotsoold

    greynotsoold Boxing Addict Full Member

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    It is easy to say that such and such is a "nightmare " for so and so because "styles make fight".
    The trick is in being able to give a detailed explanation as to why it is so.
     
  14. roughdiamond

    roughdiamond Bebop Boxer Full Member

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    My post from a while back about the strengths and weaknesses of Miguel Canto's style, and why I think certain people could exploit it. I think it fits the thread.


    'Miguel Canto

    Strengths
    • One of the greatest pure boxers ever, extremely proven against a variety of styles. There is nothing he hasn't seen, or experienced, before in /boxing. If you 15 with him, you'll probably lose. Totally.
    • Mastery of fundamental technique and application. Walking Encyclopedia of Boxing, just like his idol Willie Pep.
    • Fast (footwork and hand speed). Could throw, and land, three left hooks on ya in a flash. Could seamlessly shift from circling left, to right, repeatedly.
    • Defense. Extremely hard to hit flush. His use of footwork, slipping, ducking, Thai guard, neck rolls etc, basically ensures he is almost untouched. Canto would frequently outstretch his arms to cover wilder shots, and to touch and manipulate the opponents lead glove
    • Brain. Analysis and prediction of opponents is ingrained to his style, and has been fortified through experience.
    • Heart. Typically Mexican, despite his style.
    Weaknesses
    • Work rate and activity depends on the engagement of opponent, could be used to set and suddenly break rhythm
    • Relies on knowledge, boxing IQ, and prediction of opponents fundamental moves and patterns. This could be exploited through aforementioned setting and breaking of rhythms repeatedly within the bout. Canto could be tagged through frantic and seemingly 'illogical' movements, patterns and attacks that disrupt his pace. Would need speed to pull this off.
    • Work rate. Although extremely good at setting a pace, and adapting, Canto could still be overwhelmed shortly with less 'logical' and extremely high paced attacks and variations, if an opponent is good enough. Key word IF.
    • Power. Virtually none. Canto was virtually feather fisted. He does not have power to deter a specific aggressive strategy through force, which could be needed.
    • Chin. Questionable. Has suffered KO losses.
    • Thai guard / outstretched arms. A specific guarding technique combined with footwork. Could be exploited by a clever hooker through use of shifty feints and varying jabs, probing and direct.
    • Pint Sized. Small for his weight, though he frequently beat those bigger. Could be exploited by physical fighters, if they're good enough to touch him.
    Examples

    Miguel Canto vs Chan Hee Park 1

    The ultra talented Chan Hee Park, of Korea, exploited the deeply rooted fundamental master Miguel Canto by using his speed, skill and work rate to disrupt the reactive nature of Canto's boxing. The constant feinting, sudden switches to quick movement, and probing jab (typical of the Korean technical School) all allowed Park to exploit the small time-frames where Canto was confused in order to tag and manipulate him. Of course, this wasn't easy with such a master, but with Canto's lack of power, there was less worry physically. Park, who had limited durability and questionable heart, must have felt lucky here. Of course, a master such as Canto could even adapt to polarizing styles. He held Park to a draw in a rematch.



    Nightmare Opponent


    Jung Koo Chang / Fighting Harada
    . Two fighters with the skills, physicality and awkwardness to succeed, with greater durability, heart and greatness than Park ever had. I would always pick these two against Canto, in tough bouts of course.







    Hope this is a helpful post. Just one example, since the Park bout came to mind first. I could go into much more depth (actual full sentences!) but it would take quite bit of time and work, and you obviously need it sooner than later. Besides, I think a fighter should do it himself (with pointers, of course) to develop his fighting IQ.
    And plans mean nothing if you don't have the heart and resolve to enforce them.'
     
  15. Jackomano

    Jackomano Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I keep seeing people saying Hearns would be a bad style matchup for Mayweather, but I don't see it. I could see Hearns giving Mayweather a tough fight in the earlier rounds, but Floyd would eventually figure Hearns out, who had great physical attributes and power, but was almost one dimensional, which is why he couldn't beat SRL, Hagler, or Barkley.
     


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