Would a prime Mike Tyson lose to any of the current top heavyweights?

Douglas was closer to his loss over Ferguson than his win over Tyson when he lost to Tucker.

And while I agree that Wilder's resume is astonishingly thin for someone who has had close to ten title fights, Stiverne was highly rated by The Ring at least for their first fight. So he has two wins over two top 3, top 5 rated fighters by The Ring. That's more than Tucker has.

 

Ok, then we're in agreement then.

 

Point taken. As bad as I believe Wilder's boxing skills are, I agree that anybody who can punch like him has more than a zero percent chance.

 

I refuse to debate anymore with a child like you. You appear unable to engage in reasonable discussion/debate. Instead you resort to childish name calling that is neither clever, nor funny.

 

A bit like you yesterday then?

My point still stands, Lewis of 93 was not prime Lewis at all. He had to get sparked out before changes and improvement was made.

 

I'm not saying Douglas was considered anything other than a title challenger, at the time. But, if we're making 'quality of win' comparisons then who has the aged Ortiz ever beaten in his entire pro career to make him comparable to Douglas? No one - not even on a par with Page, I would wager; perhaps not equivalent to a green McCall or even the aging Berbick.

There's no comparison between Douglas and Ortiz, in my opinion.

 

I'm along this line of thinking too. Fury has good feet and a massive size advantage and can tie people up well, he could hang with M Tyson.
Likewise, Joshua is a good tactician and can employ a tight, rabbit-ear guard whilst counter-punching with power. Also he has a huge size advantage.
Wilder for me is too porous and would get some savage shots to the mid-section by a hard-to-hit Tyson before being blasted out. That would be a fascinating shoot-out though and I don't give Wilder zero chance at all, just much less than both Fury and AJ.

 

Proximity of the relative wins or losses are neither here nor there, in my book. And the ratings can only include assessments of the available boxers of the time. In other words, we shouldn't kid ourselves that Stiverne was anything but a plodder in the right place at the right time (until he met Wilder).

The facts remain that Tucker lasted the distance with two of the best and most dangerous fighters of the era; both of which variably find themselves in the top-10 HWs of all time. Douglas beat one of them and was the first to do so.

If we're talking levels of quality, in terms of demonstrable capability, as we should be, then both Douglas and Tucker leave Ortiz, who has also failed at least two tests for banned substances, in the wind. Wilder is so technically bereft it beggars belief. I wouldn't think it unreasonable to favor any genuinely world class heavyweight in their prime to beat him - Wilder having a puncher's chance or no.

 

based on him beating a 39 yr old wlad who was a middler in the first place when prime?
all tysons title opponents crixussed a good contender at least.

 

Why?

Tucker was durable, yes, and Douglas fought a fantastic fight against Tyson. But Douglas was inconsistent and not nearly as good against Tucker as he was against Tyson, that's clear to see from both fight. So we are still left with that Tucker's best win was over someone who lost to Jesse Ferguson four fights previous.

Not unreasonable, no. From what we know today it's also not unreasonable to say that his puncher's chance gives a decent chance against anyone. But he's still a bit hard to really asses, given that he hasn't met many quality fighters yet.

 

Why should they be in this case? Can you accurately quantify how much better Douglas became between Ferguson and Tucker and from Tucker to Tyson? I think Douglas was notably better than Ortiz; that's all I'm suggesting.

Which is still better than Wilder's best win over Ortiz (and significantly so, in my opinion); the simple point I was making on page 7.

Have you ever watched the Douglas/Ferguson bout? It's not like Douglas was utterly outclassed and in his very next fight, Douglas put on an altogether different and superior performance against Page.

I've seen enough of Wilder now to be convinced that he is, and probably always will be, a one-trick pony.

 

There isn't a heavyweight around today who could beat Tyson in his prime.

In fact I don't think any other of the fighters after Tyson could have beaten him in his prime.