Would Ali’s Rope A Dope Work On Sonny Liston?

As far as possible indicators as to how Ali’s rope a dope might fare and as to whether Ali would even employ same against Liston: -

In both of their fights Ali was incessantly on the move, very mindful not to be cornered nor engaged at close quarters with Liston.

Whenever the opportunities arose, Liston did belabour Ali’s body with powerful shots.

Post fight, Dundee noted that the resulting welts on Ali’s flanks were less apparent to television viewers.

Liston also landed a notably powerful and clearly audible punch to Ali’s body at mid range which caller Steve Ellis described as a hard, heavy shot dug just under the heart.

Later, the still 60s version of Ali willingly allowed a notable body puncher in Chuvalo to cut loose on his body but in his two fights vs Liston at least, the indications were that Ali was not inclined to go there against a fighter like Sonny.

 

Yes, I think Liston possessed inherently excellent stamina (prime Liston was always trained to the second) supplemented by perfect pacing driven by Liston’s own, high boxing IQ.

Sampling from Ali’s own labelling of his Rope a tactic, Sonny would not at all be playing the convenient role of The Dope.

 

This has a ring of truth. (although I wouldn't put anything past a prime Ali)

 

No

 

Apart from Round 5 where he accepted taking body shots to negate Sonny's ability to hit his head cleanly, by tying him up and using head control, under and overhooks to keep Sonny from planting his feet properly.

There's a moment when Ali comes off his toes and boxes off the jab and pivot in round 1, which is actually the first sign that Ali had matured and was all-time capable.

I don't think that Ali with his reach, size, superior handspeed and ability to keep Liston pivotting needs to dance and move as erratically as he did at the opening bell to outbox even a prime or peaked version of Liston. Rounds 1, 5 and 6 give me enough of a clue as to how that would play out - the Rope a Dope was borne out of necessity and I don't think Ali was ever not really in control of the fight.

It wouldn't arise versus Liston unless it was the controlling the frame element and talking sh1t to him whilst stopping him from dictating terms. Whenever he wanted to, he's going back to ring centre and boxing off the jab and pivot knowing that if he needs to, his superior footwork and footspeed can create enough distance to have Sonny missing headshots and eating right hand counters.

 

The rope a dope would have probably worked against the 1964 Miami version of Sonny that showed up. He was in 3 round shape.

 

You've obviously never watched Liston in his prime if you think he was "ponderous".