Would Ali beat a prime Liston?

Either version just wasn't fast enough. Ali was a bad style match up for Liston at any time.

 

Would Liston beat a prime Patterson, is my question.

 

It's hard to know if Clay could have beaten Liston.
I don't think we ever saw a legitimate fight between the two to help draw any conclusions.

 

The rematch if it had not been postponed may have shed some light on this as Sonny was reported to have hit on all cylinders as he had a few years prior, a physical condition he wasn't able to reach again in his career at his age. When he restarted training for the rescheduled bout it was gone with those in his camp stating he could hardly jump rope without falling over and sparring partners pummeling him day after day. Their first go had Sonny as fast as he ever was and it was enough to have the cards almost even at the end but he was just that much too slow and he always would have been.

 

Cassius Clay brought something to the game with Liston that others had not, the psychological warfare. Ok that is not enough to stop a wrecking ball like Liston on its own, but when opponents previously had been the ones psyched out by Listons baleful stare, extra padded out by towels dressing gown to give impression he was bigger than already was etc, then Clay took the psychological initiative, a new ball game was faced by Liston.

When the going gets tough, when the braggard is not succumbing to your power, when he is still fleet of foot, it is then when the psychological impact kicks in.

There will always be mystery about Listons 2 fights with Clay/Ali, but i feel Clay was the new era of boxing, the new king, and would prevail against Liston if each met in their prime.

 

I have great respect for Sonny Liston`s ability. He was a terror in the ring and it took a great fighter to take his title regardless of whether he was a shade past it.

I don`t think even a prime Liston could catch up with Clay/Ali. He couldn`t cut the ring or catch him. Ali too big and quick with a great chin/recovery powers when Sonny does clip him.

It a bad fight for Liston.

 

It's a great fight. The first Liston/Clay fight was fairly competitive although it was evident Liston couldn't cut off the ring or even try to he just followed Clay in circles. Clay had too much speed for Sonny but remember Liston was likely to have been born in 1927 or 1928 not the listed 1932. Five years is an awful big diffrence in the 1960s that would make Sonny 36 maybe even 37 years old fighting a FAST 22 Year old that was taller than him. I think a 30-31 year old Liston with that 84 inch reach gives Clay alot of problems. Remember Clay was only one fight removed from being dropped and badly hurt by Cooper. Fascinating fight could be 50/50 or 60/40 favor of Clay but certaintly a winnable fight for Liston.

 

I do not think Liston wins. Sonny past his prime is negated by the fact that Ali was blinded for a while with foul play chemicals. If Liston could not KO him then, how would he ever do so? And Ali got slighly better by '66/''67.

Boxer usually takes slugger all other things being equal, & this like prime Foreman vs. Ali is certainly no exception. Especially given the psychology.

 

Boxers do usually take sluggers all things equal but Sonny was more than just a slugger. And being 37 years old he was past it. At say 30-31 he would have better speed, timing and a lot more stamina. Remember he took Clay lightly after the Cooper fight. Where Clay should of been DQ'd for smelling salts being administered. I'm not saying Sonny wins, because Clay was so fast but I really do believe that Liston was way past it and even before he illegally blinded Clay that fight was close. First round Clay, Second Liston, 3rd round early on clay later half Sonny big (and if he was yonger he connects with a few of those rights that he just missed) 4th Clay. Then 5th obvioulsy the cheating by liston wins the round but he also gasses himself out. A young Sonny would have better stamina. I just think regardless of outcome a prime sonny gives a tough fight to clay.

 

Liston was great but what made him greater was the ease he beat good fighters. And that had a lot to do with getting the worst out them by either being stylistically wrong for them, better than them or that a good fighter was just plain horrible on the night Sonny squashed them.

I don't think Sonny would ever bring the worst out of Clay. Sonny was not stylistically wrong for clay, he was not better than clay since they were both elite fighters, I don't think Clay would ever have been just plain horrible on the night either.

So no, Liston would never beat Clay unless clay was just plain terrible on the night.

 

The best ever incarnation of Liston would always have lost to Muhammad Ali circa 1964-75. Bad style match up combined with Ali getting into his head.

 

Muhammad Ali beats any version of Sonny Liston and Sonny Liston beats any version of Floyd Patterson. For stylistic reasons I believe these outcomes to always be the same, with the only difference is that those fights might have been closer had the loser been closer to prime. In truth neither Liston nor Ali were at their best for their meetings. Ali was still developing while Sonny was past it.. A prime for prime match would have been a 1960 Liston vs a 1967 Ali. 1964 wasn't the pinacle point for either man. Floyd might have been a tad better a few years prior to meeting Liston, but I don't know if he would have done much better. He just didn't have right set of skills or physical tools to give Sonny problems.

 

Look, the truth of the matter is no Great Champion ever lost at their absolute best.

Well..... except Patterson.