Would Ike Ibeabuchi give Ali a harder fight than Foreman/Liston/Frazier/Norton did?

Ike fought a hell of a puncher in Tua who by the way set the record that eclipsed Manila despite being 2 rounds shorter. They didn't seem to weaken in the late rounds they were still fighting hard up until the 12 and final round.

IMO Frazier is not out the question.

 

I heard he had a short career but beat big Ducan Dokiwari before he went to Curtis Cokes. I was feeling good about IKE, passed a few tests, was crazy mean but I wonder if Roids was part of his mental downfall, very Tyson-Like and self -destructive...the most I can say is he shouda,Coulda,Woulda

 

I think most people will agree with me no one on Vitali Klitscho's win resume would beat 27-0 David Tua who set a record for most punches thrown, or 26-0 Chris Bryd.

 

Tua did not set a record for most punches thrown. Ike did and this was only for matches counted by Compubox, Rahman actually came close to the record against Tua himself because that turtle defense encourages his opponents to throw lots of punches. And of course Vitali broke Ike's heavyweight Compubox record recently at 38 years of age.

And at the time Tua and Byrd were in the same boat as Arreola and even Kevin Johnson to a lesser extent. Its only after Tua and Byrd went on to have success against more established contenders that Ike's wins took on such "epic" meaning. History will reveal all.

 

Come one let's be serious. Arreola and Peter get KTFO by a 1997 David Tua. Peter and Arreola also get their ears boxed off by Chris Bryd. If you really have to throw Peter and Arreola out there as the two best fighters Vitali has ever beaten, then his resume is much weaker than I thought.

 

And at the time Tua and Byrd were in the same boat as Arreola and even Kevin Johnson to a lesser extent. Its only after Tua and Byrd went on to have success against more established contenders that Ike's wins took on such "epic" meaning. History will reveal all.[/quote]


Arreola isn't even in the same ocean with Tua and Byrd. He's more of a punching bag than a boxer. You're point seems to be that Tua and Byrd wern't perceived as being big deals at the time and that their reputations improved later. But if this true, which I doubt, it just shows that they were underated at the time. There's nothing magical about the labels prospect and established contender.

Also remember Ike had no more experience than Tua or Byrd. His wins against them are a lot more meanigful than Vitali's win over a much less experienced Arreola. Although I doubt Arreola will ever get much better than he is now.

 

I'm not sure of that. 96-98 Tua had to come from behind to stop Izon and Oleg, lost to Ike, and squeezed by Wooden. Arreola and Peter are also flawed but I'm not seeing a huge performance gap. Tua was not an ATG with a ton of rising momentum at this point, he was struggling with his weight and giving inconsistent performances. He would be favored against either fighter but I'm not sure I would laugh it off as a foregone conclusion, Arreola and Peter don't match up that terribly against Tua who had problems dealing with aggressive strong sluggers as I've done mentioned, interesting matches I say.

 

-Actually no, Tua, Ike, and Byrd were creeping into consideration but Grant was the big star of their class. Its not magic words, Grant's win over the established and than feared Golota was at the time much more impressive than anything those 3 were doing, funny how history can change opinions...kind of my point.

-AndVitali had been retired for 4 years with injuries and is pushing 40, I think his win over a younger hyped and hungry contender is more meaningful than Ike beating the inconsistent Tua, who was on cruise control the first 5 rounds because he had fallen in love with his one punch power during this period...just barely getting past Izon and Oleg as a result.

 

Serioiusly, I would love to see this fight. Tua is sturdier with tighter punches but Arreola is quicker and more aggressive. Both guys also appear to be tough as nails, Walker is bombing just as much as Ike in those first two rounds and with a better jab.

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I have no doubt that Tua can punch but have seen him look very ordinary and slow, the Wooden fight was a bad one for him. Also once he caught a right hand early in the fight vs Lennox he signed an agreement to keep his distance. Tua has a lot of fat on his record and his KO over Rahman loses its luster in light of the fact that Rahman was KO'd more decisively by Maskaev 2 times while Tua only got a KO and a draw.

Ike looked fit and strong at the time but so did Michael Grant, If Grant was pulled out of the game early (before his loss to Lewis) and sent to prison we may be wondering how good he would have been. With Ike it is speculation, he looked like the goods but never proved he was. I thought Tua edged him in that fight but it was close but I have seen Tua out boxed and behind on points and slow in many fights.

Tua had some nice KO's Maskaev (suspect chin) late and a young Johnny Ruiz ( who got hit clean early and more than one punch) but he also came up empty in fights you would think he would be explosive based on his Rep

That being said Ike still gives Ali a competitive fight even if he is outpointed.

 

Is this the same David Tua who got schooled for 9 rounds by Hasim Rahman before getting a gift stoppage,got whipped by Byrd,trounced by Lewis,struggled with David Izon,was getting beat by Maskaev and again got a gift draw and couldn't drop chinny Hasim Rahman???

The same David Tua who couldn't win even an alphabet strap in this day and age when almost everyone who fights is a belt holder of some sort???

If it is then you're overrating him (as seems to happen a lot on here) very badly.He's a very limited,one dimensional fighter who happens to possess a tremendous left hook,a granite chin but very little else.

Ranking Ibeabuchi so highly on the strength of his narrow win over the oft outboxed Tua is plain wrong imo.If Ike had fought a Lewis,Tyson,Holyfield or even yes a Klitschko it would have given us a better indication of his true capabilities and how he may have fared against Ali.

As it stands I'd favour Ali to shut him out completely and possibly stop him as well.

 

:happy A voice of reason.

 

I agree with most of this, but to be fair Tua only got one title shot against Lennox Lewis, but he lost horribly.

 

Ali stopped some guys who had never been stopped before,or even after.
Mr foreman and ringo bonavena being just two. Frazier,lyle,liston are not exactly easy to stop either.
So enough of this 'he wont stop ike or tua' crap.....

 

Chris Byrd hurt Tua badly.