Would it be smart for Liston to cut off the ring more?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by reznick, Jan 8, 2018.


  1. escudo

    escudo Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Mike was good at cutting off the ring but he'd let guys off the hook far too often. He could get them to the ropes but he could rarely keep them there for more than a couple of seconds. I'd argue part of it was stylistic choice as mike would head hunt as guys circled off them. He'd look for that single KO punch once a guy was forced to circle in on direction or the other. Foreman was happy to beat the body to keep a guy stuck there.
     
  2. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Never wrestle with pigs or argue with fools Full Member

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    Yeah, I agree that Tyson let people off the hook too often after he'd cut off the ring and unloaded a few punches on them, but I don't consider that to be part of cutting off the ring per se.

    What impresses me about Tyson is that he found success using multiple approaches to cutting off the ring at times against mobile big men like Tubbs, Tucker, and Biggs. Because of his foot speed and skills, he was able to choose between working his way in with subtle lateral movement, timing his opponents with lead hooks, or just rushing them and catching them in vulnerable positions along the ropes.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2018
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  3. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    Liston didn't need the cut the ring off.
     
  4. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    No? Machen,Ali,Whitehurst, Marshall.
     
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  5. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    He beat Machen and Whitehurst by wide decisions.
    If they had any success it was on the inside. Whitehurst himself said the key to fighting Liston is not to get stuck on the perimeter, to get inside.
    Machen actually tied Liston up, and wrestled him quite successfully when he was on the ropes.
    Liston's success came from his long jab mainly. He didn't need to cut off the ring to land those jabs. Anyone who runs out of range of his jabs will pose no threat. But no one escaped him for long.

    Ali was an exception.Ali was too slippery for everyone at that point.
     
  6. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    It's absurd to compare Liston's style to Tyson.
    Tyson needed to "cut off the ring" to be anything more than a third rater. With his shortish arms and height deficit he had to leap in and surprise the opponent with speed and looping punches, then follow up with shorter hooks or uppercut. Often he'd need to cut off the ring to fix his target. You can't imagine Tyson winning a fight against someone good without imagining him cutting down the distance and having them cut off or cornered.

    Liston of course, was mainly a long range boxer.
     
  7. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

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    What nobody seems to acknowledge about this is that although Tyson had aggressive ring cutting tactics, he often got left out of position due to it, facing the ropes while the opponent was no longer there. He could get away with it because his power and explosiveness made opponents timid to counter.

    Sonny Liston was almost never left out of position to such a degree. And he fought a laundry list of mobile fighters who used constant lateral movement and outboxing tactics. Ali being the special exception, although Liston did a really good job remaining in position and being a threat. Besides the Ali fight, Liston was always in front of you, prepared for a dynamic range of attacks.

    He didn't have the aggressive ring cutting tactics that Tyson had, be he was far more often in proper position to unleash a dynamic range of attacks and counters.
     
  8. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing

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    "No boxer cut off a ring better than Liston in his prime."

    WK Stratton