Would James Toney have struggled with Joe Calzaghe?

You’re not taking into account what I’m saying.

I literally said that Joe had a better career than Nunn.

Now if you want to interpret that as him being better overall, then that’s fine.

But I’m specifically talking about technical skills, and whilst looking from the perspective of James Toney.

The specific stylistic match up between the 2.


Nunn was hard to box/fight for James. Because he was slick. He was fast with a big reach.

Whilst Joe was a great fighter in his own right, he did not possess the skill set of Reggie Johnson or Michael Nunn.

Joe was a volume punching swarmer. He was fast with a great engine.

But he wasn’t slick.

He had a very poor defence.


Go and look at his technique in the Byron Mitchell fight. His Manfredo stoppage. His fight with Reid. Just 3 fights from the top of my head.

He was very hittable. Very easy to counter. Always susceptible to a great right hand.


I’m not downplaying him.

You are overrating him, and trying to say that 2 southpaws were the same.

They weren’t.


Who did Joe actually outbox, on actual technique?

Nunn outboxing James, has nothing to do with him fighting Joe.

A completely different stylistic match up.


Who did Joe ever fight as great as James? Skill wise?

What great fighter did Joe ever beat?

He only ever beat/fought just a single great fighter, in his entire 15 year career.


He did nothing to have been favoured over James at his best.

 

In my opinion even an excellent counterpuncher like Toney, despite his defensive prowess, would have struggled against Calzaghe's workrate, who had great stamina and landed numerous shots from start to finish. It would have been a great match and I say the Toney seen against Barkley could have landed more accurate and powerful shots and won a close fight on points. Instead, the dull and listless Toney who fought against Tiberi would have clearly lost.

 

I don't agree.

Toney had a very good record against elite Southpaws he beat Jirov, Johnson, Nunn, who all brought attributes that Calzaghe had.

Nunn = He had the awkward angles, movement, handspeed, infact i would say he was more elusive than Calzaghe and certainly better than any prime opponent that Calzaghe fought.

Jirov = He had the insane workrate he threw over 1000 pounches and Toney beat him pretty clearly in my book.

Calzaghe sometimes had trouble vs counter punchers and often got hit at will with right hand counters.

Hopkins = He was still good but in his 40s and he dropped Calzaghe and had no issues landing right hand counters in a very close fight.

Reid = Literally couldn't miss Calzaghe with right hand counters knocking his head back constantly throughout the fight in another very close fight.

Calzaghe has never fought any prime opponent on the level of Toney, and his counter punching abilities/overall skillset. Aswell as Toney's very good record against elite Southpaws means Toney would be a very challenging opponent in my book.

 

This is a bit of a myth and not quite true.

Whilst Nunn had a substantial lead after 6 or 7 rounds, Toney started breaking down Nunn in the last 3 or 4 rounds prior to the stoppage and had closed the gap significantly prior to the stoppage.

You could kind of see Nunn was slowing down and Toney was starting to get him in the rounds prior to the stoppage.

People make out Toney got outclassed for 10 rounds before finding a home run left hook in the 11th round but that's not strictly true.

Calzaghe also had his own struggles against counter punchers a 42 year old Hopkins and Reid.

And a prime 36-0 Nunn who was top 3 P4P is a class above any prime opponent that Calzaghe ever faced.

 

Terror,

After viewing both of their careers, again, I would have favoured James in a prime for prime match up.

A sharp, motivated James, beat Nunn, Reggie, Barkley, Jirov and McCallum etc, at various weights.

He was exceptionally skilled. He had far more big fight experience. He had experience against southpaws.

He also had a huge ego and huge confidence.

I think he'd have countered Joe and won a decision.


Specifically in 1997, he could have just rocked up not knowing or caring who Joe was, just going through the motions, at nowhere near 100%, either physically or mentally.

Joe had little ambition for the majority of his career. Yes, Joe could fight at a fast pace. But he was very hittable, and you have to question how confident he'd have been against a prime James Toney.

How confident would he have been?

How aggressive and offensive minded would he have been?

How accurate would he have been?

The only great fighter he ever saw, was a 43 year old Bernard Hopkins.

He isn't a sound comparison though.

They were completely different.

Joe did not have Nunn's timing and technique. He wasn't as elusive.

He didn't have his reach.

Nunn was a better boxer.

 

Skill wise, NO!