Would Lennox Lewis been as dominate if he wasnt allowed to hold

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by salty trunks, Apr 2, 2021.

  1. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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  2. Boxed Ears

    Boxed Ears The Best Fighters Are American Because Nationalism Full Member

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    Oh, no, I don't mean by their ability to outbox or out-punch them, I just mean, Foreman, in no uncertain terms, should've been DQ'd against Roman and Marciano was given everything against Don Asteriskell in terms of illegal and violent fouling. It was shocking to many, really. And he normally did get away with. Unlike with my Roman and Foreman example, I won't seriously say that he should've been unequivocally DQ'd but if he'd been refereed properly, he'd have been forced to stop or get DQ'd and if you're looking at Lewis' legacy with the same filter, you have to question Marciano's dominance in some really vicious stuff he was allowed to pull that wasn't legal, throughout his career.

    Some of it was so unbelievably obvious. He basically did to Ezzard Charles what VIctor Ortiz did to Mayweather, head to mouth. It was that obvious sometimes, and nothing. Sure, I'd mostly be favouring Marciano in these bouts but if you're doing it all flirting with DQ's, without it, you're probably going to lose close decisions with point deductions somewhere or get DQ'd outright somewhere. And the original point, forgetting just these examples, is that this is everyone, you know? At least all but maybe one or two heavyweight champions (I can't really think of anything with Patterson off hand). The things that work for guys that aren't legal, if they have juice in the business world, even if they earned it with their fighting ability, it makes referees turn a blind eye, for the most part. What Carlos Padilla did with Ali was actually surprising to people. But that's because it's an outlier, which is what's wrong with judging Lewis against everyone else for this reason. Because, it's basically nothing, when it's relative to guys you're comparing him to. You know what I mean?

    "An interesting & actually serious post very good B.E.!"

    :lol: As long as it's obvious to the regulars when I'm switching reality gears, I can still come back to rational discussion and get some, I guess.

    Edit:

    Aw, man. I was serious that time. Wait-...I think I was. I may not even be sure anymore. Dammit.
     
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  3. dinovelvet

    dinovelvet Antifanboi Full Member

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    A better question is "would Wladimir Klitschko been as dominant if he wasn't allowed to hold"

    Lewis did hold quite a bit , but it was nothing compared to the fouling Gramimir Clinchko committed all throughout his 10 years reign.

    Wlad actually broke the clinch count record against Povetkin. In that fight alone he held , mauled , leaned , tugged and pulled more than Lewis did in his whole career
     
  4. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    :lol:
     
  5. SheenLantern

    SheenLantern Active Member Full Member

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    Most frustrating part is that Wlad didn't need to do any of that **** to win. He could have gotten Povetkin out of there any time he wanted.
     
  6. dinovelvet

    dinovelvet Antifanboi Full Member

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    Thats obviously hogwash. I remember Bernd Bounter during the negotiations to that fight saying there would would be no fight unless their terms and conditions were met.
    Wlad would only fight Povetkin if knew the ref would allow him to bear hug his way out of danger every 5 seconds.
     
  7. SheenLantern

    SheenLantern Active Member Full Member

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    Well obviously their concerns were unfounded since Wlad beat the everloving **** out of Povetkin
     
  8. Fergy

    Fergy Walking Dead Full Member

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    There was a lot more to Lewis than holding. He did that, like so many other fighters but that was just part and parcel of his tool kit. Only two defeats proves that imo.
     
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  9. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    He was a dirty fighter but it got him the results.
     
  10. dinovelvet

    dinovelvet Antifanboi Full Member

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    Agreed.

    A neutral ref would have issued him a DQ loss. If the ref actually favoured Povetkin and his style of fighting in close , Wlad would have been knocked out.
     
  11. SheenLantern

    SheenLantern Active Member Full Member

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    Did you see Povetkin's face after that fight?
     
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  12. BCS8

    BCS8 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Classic Dino. It's never good enough for him to have a point, he always has to strap a rocket on it and take it to outer space.
     
  13. BCS8

    BCS8 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    This. Klitschko likely would have beaten Povetkin anyway. The sad thing is that he decided to turn it into a waltz anyway. Povetkin also initiated a bunch of clinches in that one too, God knows why, but he's not entirely blameless. That fight should have been terrific, instead it was entirely sad to watch.
     
  14. dinovelvet

    dinovelvet Antifanboi Full Member

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    So? Means nothing. A punch can cause damage to skin.. . Povetkin looked the same against chambers

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    Did you see Vitali Klitschko's face after he fought Kevin Johnson? Here , ill show you.

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    Regardless of that , you're clearly some biased fanboy who cares nothing about the fair and honest spirt of competitive sport.

    Wlad prepared to win by fouling during camp because he knew his boxing wasn't good enough to get the win fairly. End of story.
     
  15. UltimateDestroyer

    UltimateDestroyer Member Full Member

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    Excessive holding isn't and shouldn't be part of boxing though, fights with loads of holding are often unwatchable
     
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