Would Mike Tyson Be Simply Too Small, To Be Successful Now?

Fury looked bad against Wallin, yes.
I think his legs aren't what they used to be, he's not as mobile as he used to be, but now he's found a trainer who helps him develop the punching power in his game, so he'll be good.
I can't see him being around 4 or 5 years from now though, maybe not even 3 years, not at the top or anywhere close to it anyway. He wasted his prime years.

I think he can be as good as Lennox, but then I never rated Lennox as highly as many do.

 

Yeah, I noticed you don't rate Lennox as highly as most. What don't you rate about him, if I may ask?

 

His opposition gets a bit overrated. That's probably the main thing. He beat some good fighters and had some good wins.
But, for instance, is Fury struggling with Wallin really worse than Lewis barely get past Mercer ? Maybe it is, maybe Wallin will remain unproven or proved to be rubbish. But Mercer was a 7-1 underdog at the time, and had been largely considered outside of the genuine 'ranked' contenders for a couple of years, he was already being viewed as a kind of gatekeeper type, and he didn't even turn up for the fight in great shape. Time seems to have obscured such details.
And Mercer WAS one of Lewis's better ones !

Another example : I didn't see anything in the Lewis-Holyfield fights that really suggests he should be clear favoured over Holyfield if both were absolute prime. It was a good win at the time, Lewis proved himself the best in the world. But Riddick Bowe had beaten up Holyfield 7 years earlier, and KO'd him 4 years earlier ! Lewis didn't even knock Holyfield down in 24 rounds (John Ruiz managed the trick a couple of fights later). As his signature win fights, that's a little underwhelming.

I don't remember Shannon Briggs or Tommy Morrison being taken particularly seriously as opponents back when they faced Lewis, not genuine contenders. But nowadays even they get cited as "superior heavyweights" from the 1990s.

 

Ok, thanks for that. You make valid points.

 

wow---- interesting but dont completely agree

 

On the other hand, I think wins like KO2 Razor Ruddock* and TKO7 Gary Mason get a little bit overlooked sometimes.
"Early" Lennox Lewis sometimes get underplayed.



* I'm not saying Ruddock gets underrated, far from it. But Lewis's win over him does a bit.

 

Lewis was impressive for his skills under Steward as well as having defeated every man he ever faced. But there were serious chin issues there, plus I too wasn't entirely blown away by his performances against a well-past-it Holy.

That said, I have him only behind Ali, Louis, Holmes, Holy, and Foreman as ATG.

 

These are good points. He also looked ordinary for most of the fight against Bruno and McCall dominated him for the short time the fight lasted.

Most ATGs have similar blemishes, though. At least if they're at the top for as long as Lewis was. But that's often forgotten when discussing current fighters. If they struggle in one fight it's taken as absolute proof that they would get obliterated by past greats, convienently forgetting the struggles these greats also had.

 

Maybe in 2024 Tyson Fury wakes up one day and decides to fight. He reminds me of a one hit wonder record, by a one hit wonder group. How can anyone make comparisons to the past greats, size means nothing, if you blow a lot of hot air and do not fight. And blame the pandemic, blowing powder up your nose. He is his own worse enemy, fictional Rocky Balboa fought more often.

 

I strongly agree with you actually. I'd like to expand on this another time.

 

He's definitely running the risk of becoming a bit of "what if". Impressive wins against Wlad and Wilder, no doubt, but you want to see more of someone who has that apparent potential.

 

Fair enough that many bend or break rules in the ring.
But there is a massive diference between hitting at the wrong time such as before the break, wrong place, clinching too much-all where survival instinct kicks in, & people have habituated bad patterns of behavior under fire...

And choosing to take illegal substances when no immediate threat exists.
And do it secretly. And there is an obvious large difference in degree & kind of cheating between that & the analogies I proposed, drugging an opponent or loading your gloves.

Your argument would still be valid if I argued that every fighter or nearly all were clean.
But I would never claim that.
Likewise we do not even know what percentage cheat with PEDs: & how much is dabbling, or for a recovery from an injury, using the wrong supplement...And how many cheated regularly or massively.

Finding one or several more minor offenses does not even show the likelihood of committing worse ones.
I (& likely you) have crossed against the light countless times. If no cars are nearby, no harm done.
Or spitting on the sidewalk or over 13 riding a bycycle on an NYC sidewalk, not good conduct...

But like say someone once or rarely overstating a deduction, it does not peove nor show how likely they would commit more serious crimes, even significant tax fraud.

 

To be honest I do want to see him fight again but a champion cannot live off of his laurels of one big victory forever, as a fighter gets older, he needs activity to stay sharp.

 

I'm genuinely astonished anyone thought Fury's win over Wlad was impressive. Wlad was nearly 40 years old. What exactly was impressive about it? I'm honestly curious.

The only impressive win Fury has is over Wilder, and if he can convincingly beat him again he might crack the top 20 ATGs...maybe. The win over Wilder is by far the best he's looked against even half-qualified opposition. And even then, the corner threw in the towel.

I don't put him up with any of the best from the past 33 years: Holmes, Tyson, Holy, Bowe, Lewis, prime Wlad...even Vitali.

Hard for me to imagine why anyone would. I imagine I'll get flak for including Bowe...but who has Fury beaten as good as prime Holyfield? Certainly old man Wlad wasn't that level and DAMN sure wasn't Wilder.

 

True, but Tyson Fury loves drama, He thinks he is a diva, maybe he should join the Bella Sisters in that True Divas show. One big victory does not cut it, fight do not blow hot air.