Would past fighters be considered journeymen under today's boxing standards?

Of course Gans would be good if he fought today. Talent is talent regardless of the era. What we have to understand is boxing was a different game back in Gans' day. Equipment was different. Footwear was different. Rules were different. Take some of today's fighters and make them fight with the same conditions and you would see a different fighter. Smaller gloves, leather soled shoes, 20rd fights, no air conditioned arenas etc..would force a modern fighter to change his style a bit. Form follows function. Take the gloves for example. Todys bigger factory made gloves offer more protection for the hands and head than the old horsehair filled gloves of yesteryear. The hands up style is more suited for those type of gloves. The older gloves didn't offer that level of protection, hence the hands down style and more hand blocking. Plus if you're fighting a 25 rd fight under a hot sun outside you have to be careful to conserve energy. No 12 rounders inside with AC. It was different back then but a good fighter is a good fighter. The old timers if they fought today would adapt.

 

Joe savage vs. Bert Cooper is on youtube. It took place a couple of weeks after Cooper was tko'd.

Kimbo, Butterbean, Rocky Gannon, etc all failed to make the transition.

I'm not saying these are perfect comparisons but none of the semi-boxers have successfully transitioned yet.

 

It is not so much a question of whether they are perfect comparisons, but whether they are meaningful comparisons at all.

 

STOP relying on the film footage to grade the fighters...

if you can't understand that the footage for Most Old fighters is abysmal, then you won't understand 'they' did everything just the same as you and I... in other words as we do today.

IF you can't accept that, then at least take the time to source out Good Film, which represents the truth of just how normal these fighters really were.

there is an Australian site which has loads of near perfect footage from the 1930s and if you type in Johnny Ralph on YouTube, there is about 8 of his fights from the 40s that is clear and good enough showing again how good and normal these fighters were.

and of course there are other great clips here and there.

you can't grade by all the poor film footage that is out there, it's no where near an accurate representation of real life... but by contrast you only need One, (1), true piece of film to understand, "well as that fighter looks great and normal, so obviously were his peers and contemporaries."

DON'T make the mistake of rating by film, because most of it isn't good enough to represet real movment and life.

 

Honestly, if somebody wanted to understand Jack Dempsey's style, I would recommend that the Cowboy Lutrell film be among those they watched.

Simply because you can see what is going on.

 

I'd say a lot of today's heavyweights would be condsidered journeymen in past eras.

 

Surely your not suggesting that these bigger stronger better super heavyweights of today wouldn't be able to use thier size to simply win fights easily

 

I think they would do better.


As fighting in their day was much harder than fighting today in terms of the gloves, rounds, equipment,...etc...


They also eate mucb better back then than today outside of the guys who drank and smoked and still foughtl.


If the talent is there they would do well in this era. I actually think very well.


But it may also depend on the style of the fighter. A brawler with an iron chin would adapt fairly easy whereas a defensive fighter might not adapt so easily but it's all speculation.

 

I wouldn't disagree with that, but I don't see the past era lighter weight guys throwing the kind of blistering accurate combinations of a DLH, Meldrick Taylor, Norris etc etc. And sorry but I don't entirely agree with the " equipment " excuse. I mean it isn't as if these guys were wearing hob nailed boots, and guantlets.

 

Indeed I am.

 

I think the skill level peaked in the 20's and 30's.
As to equipment, I remember having a pair of Stanley Mathews football boots with wooden studs that you hammered in, it was hard enough walking let alone playing football in them. Conditioning today has reached new levels with all the "assistance " available , the lighter guys, given the same help I see no reason why the Gans's Griffo's Driscoll's,McFarland's,Genaros' Leonard's of by gone days would not be as good today as they were in their own eras.
How much footage is there of Kid Chocolate ,Jackie Kid Berg ,Canzoneri,Ross? All very skilled guys.


Conversely the heavies seem bigger but not as fit and carry far too much surplus Wilder isn't great but at least he has a six pack.The Arreolla types boil my ****.

 

Hallelujah

 

Some of the guys who cracked the top ten in the heavyweight Golden Era of the 1970's....

Jose Urbain
Jose Luis Garcia
Jack Bodell
Jose Roman
Chuck Wepner
Joe Bugner
Henry Clark
Larry Middleton
Randy Neumann
Duane Bobick
Stan Ward
Johnny Boudreaux
Howard Smith
Evangelista
Leon Spinks (an actual Champeen!)
Kallie Knoetze
Domingo d'Elia
Ossie Occasio
Scott le Doux
Lorenzo Zanon
Leron Jones

That's out of a total of 50 or so fighters who were ranked in the annual top 10 for the 1970's... a large proportion were of this level.