Would the Soviet sports machine have taken over boxing had they allowed their Boxers to turn pro?

Infighters were historically poison to soviet boxers in the amateurs. The pros back then were absolutely crawling with inside fighters, so they wouldn’t have the same success they did against later, weaker eras.

 

They were the first ones to do it, so for a few years at least, they WERE the only ones doing it. We know for a fact Soviet doping was straight up state sponsored, it’s well documented.

 

You think Starling is more impressive than Usyk? Could you expand on that?

 

Yessir I think he was a more complete fighter.

 

They would've done well, not dominate. See Bowe vs Miroshnichenko

 

I think so, for a couple reasons.

Germany was smaller prewar than the Soviet Union, but "pretty small" is a relative term when you're talking about a country of 68 million people in the 1930s, which had enough of a population to invade the rest of Europe.

Specifically in the heavyweight division, Germany was unusual in being a big country with early food and exercise (via the Nazi youth programs) for young kids in their early developmental stages. Boxing was part of the curriculum, since they wanted to toughen the population up.

It's kind of like how lots of the postwar American boxers in our (real) timeline started boxing in the Army in WW2. Except it's on a society-wide scale, from childhood. And German boxing was already professionalized, with good enough trainers to produce Schmeling even interwar. They wouldn't be starting from scratch like the Soviets. Oh, and they developed early steroids before everybody else. And they're not exactly above cheating, since, well, they're Nazis.

They were more capitalist than the Soviets, but they were totalitarians.

Might end up looking like a larger, more extreme version of the unusual heavyweight quality (per capita) that you saw from the South African apartheid regime.

 

Let's say Eastern Block and my answer is they are doing pretty well today ...

 

Resident dummy here could you expand on what you’re talking about with South Africa? Could you point us towards any “Nazi raised” boxers? Schemling started boxing in 1921, interested to see what they built even if it’s amateurs etc.

 

They mostly fought in the war. The first cohorts of Hitler Youth were a little too busy getting drafted, starving and getting shot in Volkssturm units.

South Africa was a country with a small number of Europeans with a siege mentality, authoritarian government, and boxing given in an unusually privileged place in the regime. (Partly because it was one of the few they were allowed to compete in internationally.)

@BCS8 can give more details. And maybe disagree with me. I'm not saying they were Nazis, but they "punched above their weight" in terms of population size.

 

I saw a video a couple days ago touting the "Soviet style' and it made me laugh because every move highlighted in the video was straight out of the Haislet book published in 1940. If you look at the success of the Soviet, and Cuban, amateur programs, you will notice that the same guys fought as amateurs for a long time. On the other hand, the US teams had all new faces every few years because guys turned pro. A lot of the Soviet guys were more mature and experienced than the younger US guys who saw amateur boxing as a stepping stone to a pro career.
And, in the early 90s, when the first used to be Soviet boxers turned pro they didn't exactly set the world on fire, did they? It would have been even worse for them in the 50s and 60s when the difference between amateur boxing and professional prize fighting was very wide. In this era, that transition is pretty seamless because, with very few exceptions, all boxing is amateur boxing.

 

Why?

 

I think he was just better overall. Starling’s defence, ability at all ranges and his skill level seems higher he was a Futch fighter a genuine pro not some Olympian amateur tap, tap style.

 

Unless I'm misunderstanding something we essentially just did this:

A: Starling is better than Usyk
B: Why?
A: He's a more complete fighter
B: How so?
A: He's better than Usyk

 

Reducing Usyk to that is very unfair..... He's probably the most skilled southpaw in heavyweight history you don't become undisputed in two different divisions beating all the best fighters in both by just having a "tap tap" style

 

I would say he by far the most skilled southpaw in heavyweight history, partially due to there not being many great southpaw heavyweights. Maybe I'm forgetting someone though.