Would Wladimir Klitschko have gone as far without Vitali Klitschko?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by bailey, Jun 20, 2018.


  1. pipe wrenched

    pipe wrenched ESB ELITE SQUAD Full Member

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    Yes
     
  2. Potato80

    Potato80 A potato Full Member

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    Wholly agree with this. I made a thread some time ago about precisely this issue here...

    https://www.boxingforum24.com/threads/how-to-cheat-the-klitschkos-eddie-hearn.605219/

    It seems self evident that two top fighters who don't fight each other for their careers, will have much easier careers.
     
  3. BCS8

    BCS8 VIP Member

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    Good argument. It's possible that Wlad may have looked even better than he did if he had all the belts. I'd liked to have seen that timeline!
     
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  4. Brighton bomber

    Brighton bomber Loyal Member Full Member

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    Never really put much credit into the theory that Wlad benefited from Vitali beating guys like Chisora, Arreola etc. Wlad would of knocked both out, nobody Vitali beat would of beaten Wlad during his reign.

    Only time he could of possibly benefited was after the Sanders loss. Sanders instead of chasing the Vitali fight for a title might have rematched Wlad and beat him again but then again maybe he wouldn't of and gone for a rematch and went for a title like he did with the Vitali fight and fought either Byrd for the IBF belt, Brewster for the vacant WBO belt instead of Wlad or Ruiz for the WBA belt or whoever he would of been put in against for the vacant WBC belt.
     
  5. Salty Dog

    Salty Dog globalize the Buc-ees revolution Full Member

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    I can't see it. I think Bowe sleeps Wlad.
     
  6. bailey

    bailey Loyal Member Full Member

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    I wasn't saying he was protecting but asking how people may have felt it would have gone in that if you lost to a Klitschko it seemed that the opponent lost to both and was out if the title running.
    For example at smw lost to ward but got a straight shot at bute, but if you lost to a Klitschko that was as if you had lost to both
     
  7. bailey

    bailey Loyal Member Full Member

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    I'm not so sure about that
    Vitali first won a wbc title from Sanders who wlad didn't rematch
    Vitali won his next wbc title from peter who wlad didn't rematch at that sort of time when peter was still on form. Wlad had beaten peter but it was a tough fight for him and I don't know if he was in any rush at that time even though peter was wbc champ
     
  8. BoxingABC1

    BoxingABC1 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    well he would've beaten AJ if not for Vitali

    yes, i know that wasn't the context of the question, i just enjoy being a clever dick
     
  9. bailey

    bailey Loyal Member Full Member

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    I don't necessarily think one was saving or protecting the other but was asking how the landscape may have looked without the eliminated by a Klitschko scenario

    Do I think they were working together? Well after listening to things that I watched where an opponent said something about the contract like if he were to have beaten one he had to face the other next and then if he won that, have to rematch the other. Something like that and it being like a 3 fight contract if he won. I don't know how true that all is but I recall an opponent saying something along those lines but could be wrong
     
  10. bailey

    bailey Loyal Member Full Member

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    I could see how it benefited but not quite in the way you are seeing it.
    When a fighter lost to a Klitschko it seemed that they had lost to both fighters rather than just the one.
    Molina lost to Wilder but got a shot at Joshua not long after as an example of HW boxing now that the champs arent related or thought of as one fighter to a degree. I had a feeling from posts I had read that Breazeale could be facing Wilder next which if that happens is another example of the above.
    Now as written at the start of the thread. I dont think Wladimir didnt have the ability to beat any of the HWs Vitali beat but with having them beat, freed him up to fight another champ.
    Lets say Vitali hadnt have been around. Would Wladimir have wanted to have the rematch with Peter when WBC champ at that time after the tough fight? I dont know either. Now if Vitali had not have been around there would have been more contenders for Wlad to face who may have passed the other 2 titles around which may have prevented Wladimir getting some of the bigger fights.



    This content is protected

    http://www.skysports.com/boxing/news/12183/6801081/haye-confirms-contract

    That appears a benefit to me in that if one chooses not to fight, you could end up fighting the other at short notice and thats your title shot even though they are two seperate entitys.
    You have lost to Klitschko but they are two seperate fighters. That is only my opinion and there are good counter points and im not saying that is set in stone but a bit of a feeling I had
     
  11. bailey

    bailey Loyal Member Full Member

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    I think Lewis is one of the best HWS ever and would favour Lewis to beat Wladimir. Had I not watched Lewis against Vitali I would favour Lewis there also but upon seeing that fight realised that I think Lewis would always struggle with Vitali and am not sure he would always be able to beat him whereas I think Lewis would beat Wladimir more times than not.
    That said I do hold Wladimir in the same breath as Lewis as Wladimir has been a great dominant HW champ who has an excellent resume. I think you could make an argument for either having a greater resume however you want to spin it..
    I cant see why you would rate Bowe above either.
    Holyfield was a tough brave warrior but I dont know if resume wise at the time of some of the fights overall I would put him above Wladimir or have favoured him to have beaten him or Vitali, though Holyfield has got the good names on his resume like Tyson, Bowe, Lewis Draw on paper, Moorer, Foreman, Ruiz, Holmes.
    I do wonder if Bowe and Holyfield were fortunate to be around before the fighters who appeared after the iron curtain came down came to become a factor. Different eras I guess and Holyfield was my favourite fighter for a while at one time
     
  12. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist

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    Vitali wasn’t weak against boxers. He was never even down on the cards.
     
  13. guncho

    guncho next champion! Full Member

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    well i think vitali ruined Peter! He did have remach with Wlad and have good first round but beating he recieved from vit took alot of self belief out of him! IMO So yes Vitali did help Wlad.
     
  14. guncho

    guncho next champion! Full Member

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    and about easing Wlads route to unify totally agreed!(they helped each other as they said themselves if u fight one klitschko u fight both)

    vitali wanted to unify aginst haye but stepped down they could have 2 belts each!
     
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  15. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

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    It's tough to say. He may not have gone as far, but he may have conceivably accomplished more. At the very least, it would have given us a chance to (probably) see the two best of the division square off - something we never saw during the Klitschko brothers double-reign.

    I think a lot of it would also depend on when/if Emanuel ever paired up with Wladimir. If there is no Vitali, Lewis conceivably hangs around a little longer, which means Emanuel stays with Lennox. If that happens, Wlad may be regarded as nothing more than a bust with a lot of promise and a gold medal pedigree.

    Without teaming up with Emanuel, I think Wlad's career probably crumbles apart. And if Lewis hung around longer looking for the Tyson rematch, while facing the likes of Kirk Johnson, Sam Peter, and/or Corrie Sanders, Wlad probably makes a different move following the Sanders debacle, and Emanuel may not have worked with Wlad. Or if he did, it may have been years later, at which point Wlad may have been stuck in his ways without the fine-tuning to his style provided by Steward.
     
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