Would you consider 95-97 Tyson a con job

I think primes, Lewis would always be to big and strong for Holy...More complete Holyfield, but Lewis prime for me is no1 h2h ever. I also think Lewis could've took Holy out in one of them, think it was the first fight, but he played it to cautious

 

I agree with lelewis being nr1 h2h but Holyfield Beats him stylistically.
Was fast enough to hit him often and Hit hard enough to hurt him.
Lewis beats Bowe every time
Lewis Tyson peak 4 peak is 50/50
And Lewis holyfield is 60/40 for Holy

That's just my opinion based on the actual fight and Holyfields decline at that point makes me think that if that's how he did with 80%, he could pull it out with 100

 

I don't agree with that. Clearly Holyfield underestimated Lewis first time around and he got his ass handed to him, on the flip side I think Lewis underestimated Holyfield who adjusted very well in the rematch. I don't think Holyfield from 3 years earlier treats the first fight any differently, but would be more competitive. Had they fought a rematch Holyfield might well have taken it, but it's all hypothetical. That's just how I see it playing out, I do agree that we're entitled to our own opinions though.

 

Why would Lewis be ahead of Wlad or AJ head to head?

 

But Holyfield was great at using headbutts against Tyson.

 

Yea Tyson was nothing like fighter he once was. A Con Job sounds harsh but he was just going through the motions. He looked to me to be in 3 round shape. He could still punch So you had to whether the storm. Seldon, Bruno etc. We're perfect opponents.

 

I wish he had fought Lewis at that time

 

Tyson was never shy about using his head either.

 

Remember, Tyson talked about retirement after Spinks........he was already going off the rails at that time.

He showed grit against Ruddock but the finesse was no longer there, he got hit by shots he would not have gotten hit with up til Spinks. Tyson fought like I take one , lets see how you can take what I dish out and then you can hit me again.

The only thing Teddy Atlas ever was right about when he claimed when Tyson came out of the can "He dont want to fight anymore".........Bodybuilder Tyson post prison fought strictly on talent ......doing roadwork and getting his azz out of bed in the AM was unheard off..........after prison Tyson was never ever in 12 round hard fighting shape and mentally he checked out already in the joint..............but the lure of a hundred mil plus , how could he turn that down.....nobody would......so , yes , he did run a con.

He natural gifts were a great chin, power and fast hands, he exclusively used those talents in his comeback but never put the hard work in to get to 80's shape, mind and body.

The Tyson from 86-89 would stop the post prison Tyson 10 out of 10.

 

Because he was better, better than AJ anyway, Wlad has the one punch power to KO Lewis but I see Lewis going for it and Wlad not

 

No, faded for sure but not a con job.

His skillset had deteriorated even further since 1991, speed and power were still almost as good as his prime years, mentally he was just the same as before - good when in charge, not so good when he got hit and pushed back.

His speed and power were enough to demolish the likes of Bruno, Seldon and in 1996/7 he would have beaten Bowe, Moorer and Golota if they had fought. Mercer and Tua would have been very tough fights and I believe Lewis would have beaten him.

 

I agree with this.

I do think he trained hard for the Holyfield rematch, atleast he looked alot more ripped than the first fight, had better movement and balance and said he trained hard in his book.
But he was in no state mentally to win the war that he would have to go through to beat evander. He looked gun-shy in round 1. Like he was afraid of being countered to death like he was the first time and when evander saw it and took it to him, he snapped.

 

I'm on the Con side.
When Tyson came out Ray Mercer, David Tua, Michael Moorer all ranked top 10 Lewis was ranked #1. Golota was 28-1 about to fight Bowe, so he didnt fight Andrew until 5 years later. Foreman got a gift over Axel S, so they were both known choices & good ones IMO.

So he fights Peter McNeeley? Mathis Jr? Con King milked this.

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Not only was Tyson's timing horrible, around the 32 second mark,-counted down to 10 seconds where Tyson clinched that arm- IN FRONT of the ref, and he didn't once try to end that world record of a single clinch. 2nd round Mathis clinches and ref says let him go Buster, really?!?! I grew up loving to watch Tyson spark foes, but I can't deny what was in plain view a shot fighter taking on those 2 jokes? Lewis goes to court to Fight Tyson and they paid him $4 million to step aside? To fight Seldon who dropped twice to a shot to his flat top fro?

 

Well he was always going to look bad in his first few fights bavk. The con wasnt his opponents. Look at how many bums foreman fought in a row in the 80s before stepping up.
Its what you gotta do after a layoff.

The con was people thinking that he was "back". You cant tell if hes back until he was tested. The dives were a con, the gangsta rap image was a con. The guy was half the man he was when he was still trying to be a poster boy in 1987.
The con was the fact that people thouht he was badder than ever because he grew a beard and lifted weights and had people yelling allahu akbar. Ot was a front to conceal he was mentally broken.

But the timing, inaccuracy was always going to be a problem and his first few fihts would have always been bums.

Infact he should have fought more bums with different styles in quick succession like every month or so to build his confidence and sharpness. But thats not going to work with a contract with ceasars palace for your fights. You cant have bumfights on PPV and pay tyson 20 million for them.

 

Stacey McKinley stated in an interview recently that tyson told him in private "that jailhouse broke me, im not the same"
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