Would you rather your favourite fighter...

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Decebal, Sep 23, 2008.


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  1. smiffy

    smiffy Well-Known Member Full Member

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    May 14, 2008

    you're talking about a whole career there, not a single fight. move the goalposts to suit yourself, go on.
     
    smiffy, Sep 23, 2008
    smiffy, Sep 23, 2008
    #31
  2. Decebal

    Decebal Lucian Bute Full Member

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    No, an L is not an L...if it were, Duran would be a nobody and Calzaghe would rate much higher in the ATG lists, for example.

    In the boxing industry, your "0" is a very valuable commodity in the eyes of newbs or fanboys...knowlegdeable fans look at level of performance. Your example is unfortunate because Mayweather would have been greater had he performed at a top level against Margarito/Cotto and lost due to styles, than now that he has dodged them...

    In 10 years, "Mayweather" will appear in the footnotes. "Duran" will always appear in the headlines.

    Paulie? When did Paulie ever perform really well? "Victory in defeat" and "Paulie" don't really go together...

    ...victory in defeat, that's for the likes of Rafa Marquez, for example.
     
    Decebal, Sep 23, 2008
    Decebal, Sep 23, 2008
    #32
  3. Decebal

    Decebal Lucian Bute Full Member

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    ...you missed the point.
     
    Decebal, Sep 23, 2008
    Decebal, Sep 23, 2008
    #33
  4. Decebal

    Decebal Lucian Bute Full Member

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    ...true...but somewhat irrelevant. I wouldn't be happy if Bute lost but I'd rather he fought the best performing really well and lost than if he fought second raters and won, for example.
     
    Decebal, Sep 23, 2008
    Decebal, Sep 23, 2008
    #34
  5. smiffy

    smiffy Well-Known Member Full Member

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    May 14, 2008

    the question you asked related to one fight.
    are you claiming its possible for a fighter to only fight world class opposition in every fight ,even though he bravely loses each time?
     
    smiffy, Sep 23, 2008
    smiffy, Sep 23, 2008
    #35
  6. Decebal

    Decebal Lucian Bute Full Member

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    Don't worry about it, bro!:good
     
    Decebal, Sep 23, 2008
    Decebal, Sep 23, 2008
    #36
  7. smiffy

    smiffy Well-Known Member Full Member

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    May 14, 2008

    ok
     
    smiffy, Sep 23, 2008
    smiffy, Sep 23, 2008
    #37
  8. smiffy

    smiffy Well-Known Member Full Member

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    this wouldn't be yet another dig at a certain unbeasten welsh fighter ,perish the thought ?
     
    smiffy, Sep 23, 2008
    smiffy, Sep 23, 2008
    #38
  9. Carlos Primera

    Carlos Primera Boxing Addict Full Member

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    :nod
    edit:
    excellent thread decebal. your knowledge on past fighters has grown since last year. i agree, that infatuation with the "0" has, in part, played a part in the deterioration of the sport.
     
    Carlos Primera, Sep 23, 2008
    Carlos Primera, Sep 23, 2008
    #39
  10. Decebal

    Decebal Lucian Bute Full Member

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    Calzaghe? No. It's a way of weeding out those who support certain fighters for non-boxing-related reasons and want them to remain unbeaten at any cost, so that they can pretend they're the best. (fanboys/nuthuggers)

    I started the thread because an ESB buddy of mine said he'd rather Calzaghe fought Pavlik than Jones, because Jones who was underrated by many and though of as shot, but in fact could provide much more of a challenge than Pavlik and because he thought it would be disastrous if he lost to Jones, but not so much if he lost to Pavlik, because Pavlik was unbeaten and prime.
     
    Decebal, Sep 23, 2008
    Decebal, Sep 23, 2008
    #40
  11. DINAMITA

    DINAMITA Guest

    You are making a fair point here but have weighted the question too much that it is clear who you are referring to, and with this agenda implicit in the question, it does not hold much credibility, as now the pro-camp immediately say B and the others A.

    A better debate would be who do you rate higher pound-for-pound in general:

    - fighters who actively sought the toughest challenges out there and in doing so naturally incurred some losses (Oscar, Barrera, Morales)

    or

    - fighters who never went all out to get the biggest fights and face the toughest fighters out there, and so ended up with a zero but a less than stellar resume (Joe Cal, Ricardo Lopez, Sven Ottke)



    Personally I say A, because boxing is nothing without big fights, so unless we all say A and pressure the B's, we'll have a sport full of calculating career-men, zero-protectors, and that would be a sad state of affairs. You can only prove quality by fighting quality often and over a long period of time - that is the true hallmark of a great fighter.
     
    DINAMITA, Sep 23, 2008
    DINAMITA, Sep 23, 2008
    #41
  12. smiffy

    smiffy Well-Known Member Full Member

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    May 14, 2008
    come on mate, calzaghe and sven ottke should not be mentioned in the same breath.
     
    smiffy, Sep 23, 2008
    smiffy, Sep 23, 2008
    #42
  13. RealIzm

    RealIzm Boxing Junkie banned

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    Answer the goddamn thing.. It is what it is very simple not much to it....Why turn a simple question into rocket science....you put Joe C in category B not Decebal. However your post clearly puts you in category B
     
    RealIzm, Sep 23, 2008
    RealIzm, Sep 23, 2008
    #43
  14. Decebal

    Decebal Lucian Bute Full Member

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    Why not? Both unbeaten SMWs. Both in the same era. Calzaghe offered to fight him but Ottke declined.

    ...a bit like Dawson and Diaconu...;)
     
    Decebal, Sep 23, 2008
    Decebal, Sep 23, 2008
    #44
  15. Decebal

    Decebal Lucian Bute Full Member

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    No...Calzaghe was definitely a category B fighter but then he decided to fight Kessler...and became a mixed category fighter. Mayweather is more clearly a B category fighter than Calzaghe, I think. Now, I think Calzaghe is taking more of a risk fighting RJJ than Pavlik, because RJJ could expose certain weaknesses that Pavlik never could, even if Pavlik beat him and RJJ lost to him.
     
    Decebal, Sep 23, 2008
    Decebal, Sep 23, 2008
    #45
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