Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by BoxingDialogue, Jun 5, 2019.
Thread inspired by Ruiz's win over AJ.
By literal betting stats:
1. Douglas vs Tyson
2. Rahman vs Lewis
3. Ruiz vs AJ
4. Braddock vs Baer
5. Walcott vs Charles 3
My favorite upset ever tho is Foreman vs Moorer
Tyson v Douglas is the most iconic upset in boxing history, that night was amzing, it was on the front page of my British newspaper alongside Mandela being freed from prison!
AJ v Ruiz is No.2 because of the bookies odds.
Foreman v Moorer is No.3 because Moorer was nowherre near AJ`s level and had a weak chin, Foreman`s punches v Cooney were awesome but the punch he put Moorer away with wouldn`t have stopped AJ.
Can`t think of any other worth mentioning, Louis losing to Schmeling?
What were the bookies odds for Rahman v Lerwis compared to AJ v Ruiz?
Leon Spinks vs Ali.
Both were 20-1 but Ruiz vs AJ made less sense to be that drastic. I've also heard AJ vs Ruiz quoted as 13-1
Can’t say I agree with you here.
That punch put 36 stitches INSIDE Moorer’s mouth and traveled about 12-18 inches to land. It had the impact of a car wreck on Moorer.
Interesting to note, from Foreman’s book, he goes into explicit detail about how he broke Moorer down with the jab before putting the oomph behind the right hand (which he had landed throughout but kind of lollypopped in there until the big one to create a false sense of security for MM).
Foreman believed that the effect of a heavy left jab landing repeatedly and snapping the opponent’s head back — even if just a few inches each time — sent a shock down the nervous system that eventually broke down an opponent’s legs and resistance. I think he understood something that very few grasp.
So that singular right hand wasn’t thrown in a vacuum. Given AJ’s propensity to gas, had a Foreman stood up to him and broken him down properly before landing a punch that literally ripped apart the inside of the mouth of a guy wearing a mouthpiece, I’d have to say it would take out most any man.
Had the judges properly adjudicated the Fury Wilder fight where would that rank. Man comes off 3 year binge of drugs alcohol and well documented mental illness fights at less than 100 percent against an undefeated heavily hyped fighter and dominates until the final round then after being caught flush by a huge punch gets up and "wins" really was a hollywood story but robbed of the fairy tale ending. thats boxing
I'd add Morrison's win over Foreman.
Was it really an upset? That depends if Joshua can come back.
The thing about upsets is that often time nullifies their shock. At the time (from what I've heard and read; I wasn't around yet), Ali's (Clay's) win over Liston in 1964 was a huge surprise, but now since most regard Ali as the greatest or second greatest of all time, it's not a surprise that he beat Liston. Or that Foreman steamrolled a "past-it" Frazier.
The thread title is "YOUR top 5 heavyweight upsets", which could mean upsets that happened since you started paying attention to boxing and remember the consensus opinion going in to a major fight. I find I have a different perspective on fights in which I remember the feeling going in, as opposed to the fights prior to 1976 where I can only rely on contemporary sources and not my own memory.
So... My top 5 heavyweight upsets, since I started watching boxing in 1976 as a nine-year-old boy -
1. Holyfield-Tyson - Writers were penning articles expressing fear for Holyfield's life and calling for an early blowout. Pretty much no one was prepared for Holyfield's incredible performance.
2. Douglas-Tyson - Why is this not number 1? Well, at that time there were whispers that Tyson was headed for a fall, between Tyson being floored in sparring by Greg Page and his troubles out of the ring since the Spinks fight. Some predicted Carl Williams would do, the previous summer, what Douglas ended up doing. And Douglas showed some good skills in the fights leading up to his shot. It was still a shock, but in my opinion going in to their respective fights against Tyson, Douglas looked like a better fighter than Holyfield. And Tyson SEEMED to have his act together more prior to Holyfield than prior to Douglas.
3. Spinks-Ali - Yes, Ali was obviously on the downslide. But he'd held off a pretty decent contender in Shavers five months before. Spinks did not look impressive in drawing against Scott LeDoux. He was raw and inexperienced. No way Ali lets someone like that get the best of him.
4. Ruiz-Joshua - Ruiz was a 10th-15th ranked fighter, a la Roman against Foreman or Dunn against Ali. On body appearance alone, he definitely didn't look like a top level fighter. He was a late sub. Joshua was the consensus number 1 in the division and he'd already taken care of several contenders and had a handful of belts. He was the division's future star.
5. Sanders-W. Klitschko - Klitschko was on a collision course with Lennox Lewis. He was the heir-apparent. He was in against a part-time fighter we'd last seen being stopped by Hasim Rahman. No way Klitschko loses this one... Oops.
Edit : some others that shocked me over the years:
Young-Foreman, Holmes-Shavers I, Weaver-Tate, Page-Coetzee, Berbick-Thomas, Spinks-Cooney, the ease in which Holyfield took out Douglas, Golota-Bowe (despite Bowe's "winning"), Byrd-Klitschko, McNeeley-Tyson.
Some upsets that, in my eyes, weren't totally shocking -
Foreman-Moorer - We knew Moorer had a suspect chin. We knew Foreman had terrific power. We knew Moorer, at heavyweight, wasn't the most fired-up fighter in the world. Yes, Foreman was old and slow and had been outboxed by, ugh, Tommy Morrison a year and a half before. But he proved against Holyfield and Stewart he would keep coming forward and never give up. Sure, Moorer would probably outbox George and win a decision, but there was a good chance that Foreman would eventually catch him.
Rahman-Lewis I - Lewis had a great year 2000. But he was making a movie prior to the Rahman fight, he came in at what was then the heaviest weight of his career, he'd been caught before, and he just didn't seem that focused. We knew Rahman could bang a little bit and was finally getting his shot. While it was a surprise, given Lewis' lackadaisical attitude going in, it wasn't a huge surprise.
Spinks-Holmes I - Holmes looked ready to be taken. Spinks had always found a way to win and was looking to make history. Holmes was over-confident. Spinks was taking it VERY seriously. In the end it was not a super surprise that Spinks could outwork Holmes to make history.
That's the thing... depending on where their respective careers go, time might prove Ruiz-Joshua not to be that much of a shock. I really question whether Joshua can pull a Klitschko and come back from this. I suspect he might end up going the Audley Harrison route. But for right now, given the factors I noted in my previous post, Ruiz-Joshua definitely qualifies as an upset.
Tommy Morrison vs Michael Bentt is another upset