Zhang vs Joe Louis

Concur.

Wilder is done (and has been for a while, IMO).

Not that it will, but it would be bordering on criminal if, say, Wilder/Joshua was sanctioned.

 

To me it's clear as day his power isn't what it once was.
1. The fast-twitch fibers which accounted for the majority of his power deteriorate with age, along with speed. AT 38 years old, he's likely lost quite a bit of both. Not to mention his relative inactivity.

2. Based on my observations, his right hand lacks the snap and "oomph" it had years prior.

3. I don't buy this whole "Wilder only looks like **** because he's facing better competition lolz". Parker is not nearly as durable as Fury, and has shown he can be hurt, yet whenever Wilder landed his right hand, it didn't seem to phase Parker at all, with a brief exception in the last round.

 

Could be pretty horrific stuff with Wilder where he is right now.

 

But realistically their repeated failures against much smaller men aside from Louis have to raise questions about their overall ability and whether they can utilize their power effectively

Buddy Baer couldn't kayo Lee Savold (188) who was kayoed by Domingo Valin (190), Lem Franklin (197), Elmer Ray (194) among many others
Gunnar Barlund (200) who was kayoed by Lou Nova (197), Tami Mauriello (197), Billy Conn (178) among others
Eddie Blunt (219) who was kayoed by Tiger Jack Fox (184), Lem Franklin (200), Bill Poland (194)

Abe Simon failed to kayo Al Delaney (187) who was kayoed by Tiger Jack Fox (184), Harold Blackshear (190)
Lem Franklin (196) who was kayoed by Joe Muscato (187), Bob Pastor (181), Edde Simms (197)
Marty Gallagher (208) who was kayoed by John H Lewis (181) and Charley Retzlaff (195)

If Louis taking shots from these guys actually constituted evidence he can handle the power of modern SHWs that would also be true for other guys they failed to stop like Lee Savold and Lem Franklin but nobody seems to believe these guys would beat Joshua/Wlad or handle their power shots.

The evidence points to these guys not being big hitters even by the standards of their own era because they constantly come up short where much smaller men are succedding

 

Respectfully Bivol isn’t better defensively or in any way and sometimes life long pros outthink even the best for a good moment or two - to me it doesn’t prove anything expect the law of averages.

 

Small men are much harder to land on, let alone land clean on.

Precision, skill, and relative speed of the bigger man is what dooms the small guy, not power alone.

 

Sure, but to believe those guys were remotely comparable to more modern SHWs you would have to believe that guys like Gunnar Barlund, Savold, Franklin are beating/going the distance with Joshua, Wlad, etc and are better than Bivol, Beterbiev, Ward which I find difficult to believe.

What would lead you to conclude Lee Savold, Lem Franklin, etc are on par with Bivol, let alone better

 

I'm not sure what your original point about Bivol or Beterbiev was. Only giving my thoughts on the Baer and Simon criticism.

Even the hardest of punchers had off-nights, stylistic difficulty, or a man who just wouldn't kiss the canvas that night. Not to mention sometimes fighters wanted theirs rounds in to develop.

Earnie Shavers had supposed blemishes like going the distance with Vicente Rondon who in his two previous bouts was stopped by both Lyle and Foster.

Unless you are a combination of superb ring generalship (Foreman), accuracy (Liston), or relentless stylistic aggression (Tyson, Frazier), some of the slickier or sturdier fighters are surviving the night despite the difference in overall class.

And even if you are all or some of those things—there is always this one defensive wizard.

 

Ok so you think the punching power of these 3 men is questionable because they struggled with smaller opponents? Let's do some math.



Buddy Baer's biggest opponents.

Tony Galento 247 lbs KO Win
Eddie Blunt 219 lbs Decision Loss
Valentin Campolo 225 lbs KO Win
Charley Neaves 210 lbs KO Win
Sandy McDonald 215 lbs KO Win
Big Boy Brackie 218 lbs KO Win
Chuck Crowell 213 lbs KO Win
Eddie Hogan 222 lbs KO Win
Abe Simon 250 lbs KO Win
Jack London 220 lbs Decision Win
Patrick Barry 226 lbs KO Win
Babe Hunt 230 lbs KO Win
Ray Jarecki 255 lbs KO Win
Jack Petric 220 lbs KO Win
Frank Connolly 243 lbs KO Win
Bob Cook 242 lbs KO Win
Tiny Abbot 230 lbs KO Win


Buddy Baer has a a record of 15 wins (14 KO's), 1 loss against bigger men who are 220+. He has an 88% KO Ratio.

This flat out proves that his power is very real and effective against larger, modern sized men. Perhaps the smaller men were just too skilled to get nailed hard? As I said, height it height, muscle is muscle, power is power. If Joe Louis' chin can handle the punches of a 6'6 250 pound man with an 88% KO ratio against men who are 220+, he can probably take a punch from a modern super heavyweight.

 

He was out on his feet from Smokin Joe Smith.

 

Smith hit him like Frazier.

 

Joe Louis KO
Zhang has got a better chance standing in front of a firing squad.