Zora Folley Discussion

Whatever man, now you are trying to spin an obviously incorrect post. Terrell did not come out to take the lead away from Williams. He boxed using movement and a jab. Try to paint that as being an aggressive come forward style all you want but it wasnt. He beat Williams by boxing him and countering him. Same as Ali. If you cant even admit you are wrong on those counts then whats the point of the discussion?

 

Fifty is over the top but I'm sure he was 35 or 36 n Miami.

 

The first time Williams and Terrell fought it was Terrells first real step up in class and he was facing a guy who had been fighting for 11 years. The second time they fought Terrell controlled Williams who had moments but didnt never looked like a world beater. I dont know how anyone (you, hardly an unbiased source as youve said more than once your dad was a big fan of Williams as you clearly are as well, or the AP) could have thought Williams won that fight. Terrell was by far more effective, landed more, fought his fight and controlled Williams. Williams was coming forward but was largely ineffective. The ref correctly ruled the slip when Cleveland tagged Terrell and attacked he blundered Terrell into the ropes and in bouncing off Terrell lost his footing and took a knee for not even half a second. How do you rule a KD without a punch??

Williams having inconclusive fights with his betters hardly proves he was on their level in any regard. But by all means lets not judge the man based on his thin resume or we might not have an argument hmmm? I mean after all lets look over his wins over contenders vs. Machen and Folley and suddenly Williams begins to take a back seat... WAY back.

 

I thought Folley's effort against a prime Ali was quite admirable.
Ali was phenomenal at that point in his career.
Folley was a few years past his best.

Folley landed some nice rights in the early going.
I always look to that fight as one of those relevant when we discuss what a prime Louis would have done with a prime Ali.
I lean towards Louis, partly because I see him landing similar but harder punches.
On the other hand, I would expect Ali to raise his game even more faced with such an opponent.

It's a shame Folley's fight with Liston doesn't exist on film too. He didn't last 3 rounds but apparently had Sonny in trouble, it was competitive while it lasted.

 

I don't think so...Machen was..even if he did lose a decision to Folley and did no better than draw in their other bout. Machen's stand against Liston impresses me more than any of his victories...he did much better than Folley did, and I would wager that he would have done better than Folley vs Ali if they ever met. Machen had more ***** than Folley and could "think outside of the box" better than the zipped up, buttoned down Folley.

 

The punches that Ali knocked him out with at the end seemed to barely land, which was strange.

 

I really liked Zora Folley based off of what I've read about him and what I've seen on film. Good overall skills, a smart fighter, decent speed and footwork, but a smallish HW who was not the most durable HW of his era. Pretty much on par with Machen, actually I'd rate Folley better overall but Machen seemed to be more durable most nights.

Folley beat Howard King, Eddie Machen (they also fought to a draw), Henry Cooper (he also lost to Cooper), Mike DeJohn, Doug Jones (he also lost to Jones), Billy Daniels, George Chuvalo, Karl Mildenberger, Oscar Bonavena (he also lost a MD to him late in his career), Bob Foster, and others. Ali stopped him in the 7th round.