Which 1970 s Heavyweight Is Far Too Overrated, IYO?

I think Shavers gets a lot more praise than he deserves compared to the likes of Terrell Young Quarry and Ellis

 

My point is without Ali his resume is pretty sparse, Ali is obviously an amazing win the rest not so much.
I don't see how Foreman run means they do he was the second best heavyweight of the era none of them were comparable to him you can't extrapolate one person's success to the whole era.

 

Patterson was past his best and a fight he arguably lost. Mac Foster and Shavers I wouldn't consider partically good. Lyle is a good win I admit

 

Via that standard how many elite wins does anyone in HW history really have? Your standard for top win seems to be one of the top fighters in the history of the division. Or something close to that.

Him being relative to the best HWs of the 90s at his advanced age suggests the 70s HWs were superior. Same goes with Holmes.

Fraziers resume from a quantity standpoint is very sparse. He did not fight very long. That is a seperate issue.

 

Probably Ali. I think there are several arguments against him being the consensus #1. I think that boxing's top ten heavyweights is really more of a gentle plateau than a pyramid. I could totally see guys like Holmes, or Lewis or Holyfield as being better than Ali at their peak. Ali might also have won some of his fights more 'on paper' than in reality thanks to favourable judging.

 

My standard of a good win is a win over a fighter who has proven himself by being able to contend with top fighters in that era imo it would be Foreman, Ali, Frazier,Norton and Young. Among heavyweight I think Ali, Lennox and Holmes all have a decent number of good wins.
That's not how that works especially since he was one of the best fighter in the era it shows how good he was not how good the guys he demolished in that era were and saying he was relative to the best is a bit generous he was competitive with them but still clearly lost to Holyfield and Morrison only being able to beat Moorer because of his glass chin

 

lol

 

I agree. I'd even rank guys like Cleveland Williams, and Nino Valdez ahead of him.

 

Can you name one?

 

Contrary to this thread title, Jerry Quarry is underrated in my opinion. Better resume than people realise.

 

Frazier essentially cleared the list of top contenders during Ali’s absence to establish himself as the best, he fought almost everyone of note up till FOTC.

 

Shavers had his moments tho. He poleaxed the #5 rated Jimmy Ellis is under a round and pole axed the #3 ranked Norton (behind Ali and Holmes) in under a round as well.

He also came extremely close to winning the crown twice. He was probably one good haymaker away against Holmes and some think he won vs Ali. He had some downs but his ups were well above those two. Having KO'd not one but two top 5 contenders in under a round would have to be awfully rare.

 

Frazier beat Bonavena x 2, Chuvalo, Ramos, Quarry x 2, Ellis and Bugner besides Ali, so the the concept that his greatness rests wholly on Ali is a bit flawed. You can turn it and say that he was unlucky to be in the same era as Foreman. And Foreman is not only defined by his wins over guys that beat Ali, but also by winning the HW title in his 40's after a ten year hiatus. So nothing really works in your reasoning.

Likewise, while I agree that Norton wasn't great (and I haven't really seen anyone say this), he alos has more good wins than only Ali on his record and he gave prime Holmes his closest fight, while probably being past prime himself. And Holmes would also go on and have success in the 90's.

So if there's no Ali, Frazier and Norton only loses to Foreman during their prime run, and Foreman will prove to be competitive with two decades further on. As will Holmes.

That does not look too shabby to me.

 

You can make any list you want really with some hypothetical h2h. But if we're looking at resume Ali and Louis are the top 2 and no one else even comes close.

 

Weak according to what criteria? In one of the most competitive eras in division history, he virtually cleaned out the class. Ali, Quarry, Bonavena, Ellis…if this is weak what could we say of a Tyson, Dempsey, Holmes or Marciano?