Archie Moore versus Wladimir Klitschko's opposition

See I think haye beats Patterson as well.

And the haye fight was what, 4 years into wlads rein or something. Remember Archie is fighting to the schedule so he would be about 212 when the fight took place.

 

Even if pianeta ko1's him I say he's already achieved greatness.

 

I don't think Peter was finished when Wlad rematched him. The thing about Sam Peter is you have to ask, .... when was he in decent shape ? ... when was he out of shape ?
Both times he fought Wlad he was IN SHAPE and coming off some decent form. That's all I'm claiming.

Against Helenius he was hog fat. Against Chambers he was out of shape. Against Vitali he was out of shape.
I'm sure if someone lists his weights for each of these fights, they should confirm what I'm saying.

What are Wlad's best wins ?
Byrd x2, Chambers, Ibragimov, Haye, Chagaev, Thompson, Brock. ... etc.
Some of those had never even been beaten before, so I don't know what you're talking about.

 

On form Byrd and Brewster are nothing to shake a stick at for a 200 lb iffy-chinned former light heavyweight. Haye as well. Those would be the toughest bouts.

Like someone said surely he'd pick up a few L's along the way.

 

He goes about .500 or slightly less. Too small, too content to engage, which against these true heavies would be detrimental.

 

He was in woeful shape through out his WHOLE career... Wlad escaped a ko loss to him first time because he was unable to move any faster than a snails pace. If he had any stamina he would of put Wlad away..If i didn't know any better i'd have thought he had weights in his boots....When lower tier , B level guys who never held a title beat Wlads best wins better than he beat them himself, its clear to anybody thats he's not that great at all.

 

You'd be about the only one.

 

Yep:deal

 

What other heavyweights are judged by their achievements at 37? Which other heavies who have ruled the division for 7 years are not afforded the inevitable late stage loss?

 

I think the consensus on ESB classic says that Wladimir still has to fight for another 4-5 years at least, and win 10-15 more fights before he gets his dues.

but of course, if he carries on dominating his opponents in tedious fashion, he'll never get his dues anyway.

He needs to go all Foreman-Lyle full ****** once or twice to get real recognition.
Either that or grow some dreadlocks.

 

Nah, too ONE-SIDED.

(It's debatable which way that is though. :think)

 

So, Lennox's greatness is based on his career defining fight with Vitali. That is what you are saying.

If you truly believe that, then your argument regarding Wlad makes sense. And Ali should be judged based on his effort against Holmes.