Bob Fitzsimmons vs Joe Frazier

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by yancey, Aug 18, 2009.

  1. Boilermaker

    Boilermaker Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I have a bit mre time now.

    I have to say, that if were given the task of beating Bob Fitzsimmons for the world Championship and i could choose any fighter in history and my life depended upon it, i think i would probably choose fight of the century Joe Frazier (not that i think this is the Greatest fighter of all time), at the very least he would be right up there.

    This is a very tough assignment for fitz. Look at what Smoking Joe did to other great light heavyweights or smaller fighters that he faced.

    IN particular, he knocked out Doug Jones in 6 rounds. Doug may not have been fitz, but he was a very good smaller man, who had a proven record or chin against heavyweights. He went the distance with the like of Machen, Folley, Prime Ali (clay) and Terrell. Frazier knocked him out in 6 rounds.

    Also, Bob Foster. Many people (not me) consider Bob Foster to actually be a better light heavy than Fitz. Frazier dealt with him brutally with a KO2. Not bad for someone who some are saying was a "slow" starter.

    Prime Frazier actually beat Muhammed Ali. Ali is similar to Corbett. But most would agree that this Ali was a little better in every respect. And on the whole, Frazier's win was every bit as dominating as Fitz win over Corbett. Probably more so, despite there being no KO.

    Fitz on the other hand, goes into this fight having to devise a strategy. I am most worried about Fraziers high work rate. He hits Frazier regularly, more regularly than Fitz has probably ever been hit. And Frazier is stronger in the clinches. And very solid in his defence also. I dont see the sort of puncher that can be lured into a trap.

    In Fitz favour, outside of JEffries, he did blast out every heavy boxer he ever faced. And Jeffries only won by taking insane amounts of punishment that would not be allowed today. Saying this, i dont think Fitz ever fought anyone like Frazier. Although when you think about it, the closest he fought was Tom Sharkey. Sharkey was an iron man like Frazier, reasonably comparable in size and strength and able to keep going like Frazier. His chin was probably in the same class also. Fitz demolished him twice. Okay, technically he was Dqd the first time, but i think that if he finished the same way against prime frazier, most would be pretty impressed. And the second time he simply demolished him in 2. Gus Ruhlin was another big puncher and decent sized fighter demolished also. This isnt as one sided as i would have thought.

    Now i think further, Fraziers worst loss was to Foreman. And why, Because he was layed out with some big shots and he couldnt handle the power. Fitz had much better technique than Foreman, but surely he couldnt do the same thing? Most say Foreman could push Frazier and stylistically this set him up to nail Frazier perfectly (from a stylistic point of view). Thinking further, this is exactly what Fitz specialises in. He may not use power, but he hits and times the punch when the other fighter is off balance and uses their weight against them. Fitz is a very live punchers chance here and he did beat the similarly iron chinned Sharkey without a chance.

    Saying all this, my money is still on Frazier, just not as supremely confident. And, that confidence would drop even more if there was a Fitz-Frazier II and III taking place the same time frame as Ali Frazier II and III.
     
  2. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล

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    Not at all. He may have thrown straighter shots but there's absoutely no proof he had better technique. Especially as Foreman showed a good jab and threw his shots so well himself.
     
  3. Boilermaker

    Boilermaker Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Maybe, but i always thought that Foreman arced his punches a bit. Knocking guys out with more power than precission.(as opposed to say Early Tyson) who was all precision, like Fitz (though he had massive power as well).
     
  4. janitor

    janitor VIP Member

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    There is no question that he had better technique than Foreman.

    For christs sake he was a better one punch finisher than Foreman at heavyweight and he only weighed 165 lbs.
     
  5. Mr Butt

    Mr Butt Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    frazier not always a great starter but still wins by stoppage by the 6th
     
  6. Stevie G

    Stevie G Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    No disrespect to Fitz,but I can't see Frazier having many problems here. Early ko.
     
  7. djanders

    djanders Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Prime against prime, 12 rounds: Frazier in trouble in round 1 and down once in round 2. Fitzsimmons down once in round 7, once in round 11, and in serious trouble in round 12. To the amazement of most at ringside and on this board, Fitzsimmons is bloody and staggered, but still standing, at the final bell.

    Winner: Frazier by unanimous 12 round decision...in my opinion. :D
     
  8. Freedom

    Freedom Guest

    Frazier smokes Fritz.
     
  9. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member

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    There is a posibility that Frazier walks into one ,but I think his all action offense is all wrong for Fitz ,he would not have the time to punch pick that Jeffries and Sharkey gave him.
    Frazier overwhelms Fitz and I tend to think it would be early, just a styles thing.
     
  10. frankenfrank

    frankenfrank Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Frazier by KO.
    one of his easier wins.
    too tough , too strong.
    most of fitzsimmons' wins were against bums.
    although in his time this is what anyone could get.
    he also was stopped by some of them even before he was old (i know this will be the excuse for some of his late loses)
    check boxrec and you'll understand he wasn't that good in all-time perspective. he was a p4p great in HIS time , but not all-time , hell no.
     
  11. essexboy

    essexboy The Cat Full Member

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    No offense mate but you chat some **** in alot of your posts. 'Non-Pareil' Jack Dempsey, 'Gentleman' Jim Corbett, Tom Sharkey and George Gardner were all beaten by Fitzsimmons, he also got a newspaper draw against 'Philadelphia' Jack O'Brien. These were all world class opponents at the time. You really shouldnt rely so much on boxrec, Fitzsimmons often fought men far heavier, he was a middleweight who won the heavyweight world title for godsake, the next person to do that was Roy Jones Jr about a hundred years later, hes one of the greatest boxers pound for pound ever.

    The only thing your right about is Frazier winning.
     
  12. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล

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    Not from the footage I've seen Janitor. Which is what I go by. But I respect your opinion nonetheless.

    I don't doubt that a lot of posters that rate Fitz would probably see him beating Foreman? Is that fair to say. Foreman would blast him out very, very early indeed IMO.
     
  13. frankenfrank

    frankenfrank Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    i said MOST of his oposition i DID NOT say ALL of his oposition.

    do you have better resources ?

    i did say he was great p4p of HIS time
    roy did not really won the heavyweight title , he didn't defeated John Ruiz , a weak heavyweight who is really a blown up cruiserweight , and not too big one at that , who barely got questioned 1:1:1 with a faded holyfield to win a vacant title. this is not a legitimate title for me.
    the best heavies then were lewis , vitali klitschko (jones' mandatory)
    :rofl

    also , in most of the cases when he fought guys much heavier , he lost
    , but for you and your kind when i write 'most' in your brain interprets it as 'all' , so , not 'all'.

    at least you know that
     
  14. frankenfrank

    frankenfrank Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Sorry , i made a typo it's 'did' instead of 'didn't'
     
  15. janitor

    janitor VIP Member

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    I don't think that even the most optimistic old timer suporter would pick him over George Foreman.