Calzaghe's legacy is already fading........

But where is the solid 10 year resume? That is what this discussion is about.... no? To me, the man's talent is not in question, not his skills, his chin, conditioning..... none of it. He very well could have gone on to be a high level ATG.....if he had the body of work to sustain it. It's his resume that is the impediment. Whether it is his fault or his prospective opponents faults or no one's fault at all.......I don't care. That's not the issue here. You can only measure the resume by who he actually stepped in the ring with. An extremely weak resume is supposedly bolstered and pushes him into ATG status by..... a win over a heavily favored, but overhyped Jeff Lacy who did nothing after.....a win over Mikkel Kessler, whose own resume is nothing to write home about and did nothing after, A split decision win over a 43 yr old Bernard Hopkins, and a thrashing of
stick-a-fork-in-him-he's-done Roy Jones Jr. How do these, as supposed career defining wins, bring him into the fold of the ATG's? Not even these hold up to even general scrutiny, and they are supposed to be the standard bearing wins? All the other accomplishments are great and should be recognized .....years of dominance.....belts and titles...... many, many title defenses............ these things afford him a place in boxing history. But, unfortunately, against whom did they come? Where is the resume? That is why he won't be looked upon as highly as he could have been or as highly as you'd like. Top 50 is being too optimistic.

 

Whilst I do agree with you, in that there can be different circumstances involving a victory over an opponent and that opponents subsequent performances, the fact is that if anyone does use Joe's win over Kessler as an example of his legacy then they must accept the counter argument, which is Kessler's defeat to Ward. As you rightly say, had Kessler went on to dominate the "Super Six" and the 168 division, it would have been an even greater victoey for Joe, but the fact is that Kessler got stopped. Of course the "Counter" to the counter is Bernard Hopkins!! Joe beat him and look at how Bernard has performed since then! I just wish that Joe hadn't retired when he did, I wish he had fought a re-match with B-Hop and beat him again! The problem is, when is a good time to retire? Had Joe been born 10 years earlier he would have had the opportunity to fight true legacy building fights and I truly believe that he would have been a handful for any of the previous generation of superstars. Had he been born a few years later than he was, he would have been mixing it with the likes of Abraham, Ward, etc. My guess is that should one guy dominate the "Super Six" then people will already be comparing him to Calzaghe, who reigned for over 10 years!! And let's suppose Joe comes out of retirement and fights the winner of the "Super Six". If he wins, great! That should seal the deal, once and for all! but what if a past prime Calzaghe loses? People will be so quick to trivialise him and his achievements!! It was always frustrating being a Calzaghe fan, his injuries and long periods of inactivity robbed his fans of the opportunity to watch him perform at his peak. And now that he's retired it's even more frustrating being a Calzaghe fan! Whenever I consider Joe I think "A great fighter, who through many reasons (some of his own making) never did show us all how great he truly was".

 

which is the problem joe had.

he could only beat the people who were around in his time, and it wasn't the greatest of divisions we have ever seen.

as for fighting pavlik, joe was starting to show his age by then and knew he was going to retire soon, so he wanted 1 last payday.

i wudn't like to see him come back to fight anybody (perhaps Froch, but thats a different story) because he quit to protect his long term health and i congratulate him for that.

 

I wouldn't like to see him return either Danny mate, although I agree a Calzaghe-vs-Froch fight would be huge, here in Britain and imo I believe that Joe wins that bout comfortably, even now!! As for his opponents your right Danny he could only beat who he fought and he did, beat them every single one of them! But mate, be honest, do you never feel that he maybe could have fought better people at times? I do. As for his 1 last pay-day, I have no problem with any fighter earning a pay-day especially not an undefeated champion of the world but the way he took the **** out of a shot to **** RJJ was not too pleasing on the eye! Especially when a re-match with B-Hop or a bout with Pavlik were possibly available, both of which, at the time would have been competitive and actually meant something? And they were fights Joe imo would have won!! He will probably never receive the recognition he deserves, which is frustrating! And whilst some of that is not his fault, some of it is.

 

Your train of thought must get easily derailed. I thought Pacquiao was a great fighter but then Morales quit and got fat, Barrera lost to Khan and Marquez lost to Floyd. Ali was a fraud because Frazier got taken out by Foreman in two or because Foreman lost to Jimmy Young or Liston never did any good after their fights. Sure showed us. See...that's just silly.

 

FFS... Do we need another thread like this??

 

hopkins???
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Ummm.......What does that mean? (A little context)

 

What if Ward becomes the p4p G.O.A.T?

 

Then Calzaghe wont be the greatest SMW of all time again harming his legacy

 

Pacman lost too Rustico Torrecampo, what did this guy ever do? I have no respect for Pacmans legacy now......:shock:

 

stop being stupid
Pac-mans legacy aint built on Rusico Torrecampo

Also the discussion is about Calzaghe's greatest wins over Lacy, Kessler RJJ and Hopkins and thats what Calzaghe's legacy is mainly built on.

 

Point i am trying to make is that even one of the greatest of all time can slip up, lack concentration, lose when inexperienced. However Calzaghe has gone through 46 fights not letting up once, maybe the oppo has not been the best it could have been but 46 fights unbeaten? takes some doing.

 

That's a fair point.

 

I like joe but his legacy wasnt the strongest to begin with, but hopkins was still a good win even at his advanced stage, rjj was well gone and kessler was decent, but i dont think we saw a top form kessler against ward, kessler hasnt actually fought a live body since calzaghe and with all his problems he has declined somewhat i feel