chavez all time pound for pound

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by cdub1012, Feb 11, 2008.

  1. eliqueiros

    eliqueiros Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Chavez was the ultimate grunt. He wasn't flashy like Leonard or good looking like DLH with flashy combinations, so he tends to get overlooked. But the guy was a wrecking ball.
     
  2. bandeedo

    bandeedo Loyal Member Full Member

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    you are speaking of theory and not just an unproven theory but an untested one and yet YOU CAN tell me with certainty. i respect your sentimentality but i am fully aware that it is only certain fighters that inspire that in you.
     
  3. angelos

    angelos Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Woah, awesome vid Paenkhay on the legendary Pancho Villa. I heard the reason why he died was because of tooth extraction.
     
  4. chimba

    chimba Off the Somali Coast Full Member

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    Writers and boxing experts have pretty much the same lists all over the world...you wanna deviate from that in order for you to be satisfied..Thats OK by me. You want to think JCC is top 5, thats cool.

    But I tell you ..with the exception of me putting Pancho Villa in there (an embelishment) The list is the list...SRR or Duran..ALI...I cant argue..I have no bias against anyone regarding ATG's..and apparently so do boxing historians.

    I like both Old timers and Modern fighters equally
     
  5. bandeedo

    bandeedo Loyal Member Full Member

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    writers and experts do NOT have the same lists. the fighters are the same but the tiers they occupy differ.
    im very glad i have your permission to deviate from the list, you know how dissatisfied i get.
    thats cute how you exagerated my placement of chavez from 15 to 5 in order to try and make my argument appear ridiculous. it made me smile.
    i also like early as well as modern fighters. i just dont think you can accurately compare their effectiveness on an even plane.
     
  6. chimba

    chimba Off the Somali Coast Full Member

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    Well show me a list that have Chavez in the top 15. Is this your preference or is this an objective placement,

    As for the last point, sure you can..like I said these modern fighters didnt exist back then...

    Now those great fighters then were the best of the lot...for ****s sake Villa traveled halfway across the world..they were combing the world for talent they were the best in their profession at the time..

    now given the same advantages that modern day presents..those elite bunch back then can only improve...its not that great of an assumption, they were already great fighters...meanwhile Floyds grampa wasnt born yet..now Floyd fighting in that era will be hard to prove..given the same circumstances
     
  7. bandeedo

    bandeedo Loyal Member Full Member

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    like i wrote, i have chavez top 15 of fighters "I" can "realistically" assess. i cant accurately assess a fighter from grainy fight film that is not even in real time. i am not going to evaluate a fighter on hearsay because it would not be my honest assessment. i imagine if all writers and experts used my criteria and honesty, a few of them might put chavez top 15.
    when your boy villa was traveling all over the world as the best of the lot, the worlds fastest sprinters were travelling the world claiming a 3 minute mile was impossible so get a little perspective.
    your finall assumption is flawed because you assume villas defense would improve enough today to take him to the top. that is a pretty big assumption considering guys like mayorga or hammed and dozens of others could just not do it. he may have, but then again, he may have not. my point is that you, along with all the other experts, just dont know.
     
  8. chimba

    chimba Off the Somali Coast Full Member

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    Of course Im assuming people back then would improve..you said it yourself..people broke the 4 minute and the 3 minute mile theyve gotten better..

    If we start with the premise of us not knowing anything...then thats ok..coz frankly nobody knows ****! That we can agree on
     
  9. joekirkbycobra

    joekirkbycobra King Of The Ring Full Member

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    i always tend to have him 4 or 5
     
  10. bandeedo

    bandeedo Loyal Member Full Member

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    why do you neccesarily think people have gotten better. maybe those competing back then were just not that talented. its only been one lifetime, you are not talking about centuries. maybe those people with the genetics to break the 3 minute barrier or go 70 fights undefeated were too busy working in the fields somewhere. do you see how many factors impede an accurate comparison between these generations of athletes.
     
  11. gambleer

    gambleer Well-Known Member Full Member

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    If Eder Jofre were american, and not brazilian, he would easily be in the top 20 of any list.
     
  12. T.C.W

    T.C.W Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    top 10, love this guy and the way he fought, He was like a tank just keep coming, worked the body better than any other fighter I have ever seen.
     
  13. 4Rounder

    4Rounder Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Obviously top 20 ATG.
    It case can be made for top 10.

    Sometimes I wonder why so many people hate him. Was beating Taylor that bad to ignite that much animosity towards him?

    Great video btw, never seen it before. :good
     
  14. PaddyD1983

    PaddyD1983 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    1. Sugar Ray Robinson
    2. Willie Pep
    3. Muhammed Ali
    4. Jimmy Wilde
    5. Roberto Duran
    6. Alexis Arguello
    7. Julio Cesar Chavez
    8. Pernell Whitaker
    9. Henry Armstrong
    10. Carlos Monzon

    Proverbial cat amongst the pigeons...
     
  15. Sweet Pea

    Sweet Pea Obsessed with Boxing banned

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    On the way out? Chavez was the #1 P4P fighter in the world when Pea schooled him. He had just recently scored dominating wins over Haugen and Camacho. He only weighed in at 142 on fight night against Whitaker, so let's not act like the weight affected him, or that he was fighting a bigger man.

    Chavez was much more past it when DLH beat him than when Whitaker beat him, and I had a past his prime Whitaker edging DLH, as many others did.

    I disagree. Pea jumped from 135 to 154, winning titles in every division, including unifying and becoming undisputed LW champion, while defending his WW title 7 times. Chavez jumped from 130 to 140, and his resume, in actuality, is not better than Pea's at all, that combined with Pea's schooling of Chavez.

    Pea's top wins: Chavez, Nelson, McGirt X2, Vasquez, Ramirez X2, Mayweather, Haugen, Pendleton, Nazario, Lomeli, Paez, Pineda, Rivera X2, Hurtado, etc. and depending on how you scored it, possibly DLH, as many believe it was a robbery.

    Chavez's top wins: Taylor X2, Rosario, Gonzalez, Randall, Haugen, Camacho, Mayweather, Ramirez, Limon(ancient), La Porte, Lockridge, Castillo, etc.

    I give the edge to Pea.

    Even if they haven't seen their skills, they've seen their resumes, which outshine most modern fighters.

    Now you're just showing that you don't know what you're talking about. Then again, I guess you already did that.