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Chris Byrd v Primo Carnera

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by McGrain, Jun 2, 2014.



  1. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Byrd is so talented that he was able to stay in there with Vitali Klitschko almost punch for punch by Compubox (Klitlickers note - I think Vitali was ahead when he pulled), an astonishing feat that underlines his exceptional skill and poise. He was a specialist, but he wasa specialist. Byrd is often overlooked in my opinion - so I have to parts to this question really. Which heavyweights post-Holmes would you name as being more skilled than Byrd?

    And second, how do you think Byrd would get on with Carnera? Carnera was a decent boxer with huge size who sepcialised in beating up smaller opponents because most of his opponents were considerably smaller. He took Loughran and Loughran is in many ways a forefather of Byrd just as Carnera was a forefather of Klitschko.

    So what about it? Does Byrd's skill in combination with his greater size than Loughran's make him a favourite over the Ambling Alp? Or is that jab, size and strength going to be just a bit too much for the super-slick Byrd?

    Any and all thoughts on both fighters are welcome.
     
  2. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    They were mediocre.
    Byrd's one of the worst of all the alphabet champions.
    Carnera was utter crap relative to his physical advantages.
     
  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Except this :lol::twisted:
     
  4. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Probably not many. He was quick and technically gifted. His relative small size for the era he was fighting in, lack of snap to his shots, and somewhat shaky chin were his downfalls. Michael Spinks, Evander Holyfield, and heavyweight versions of Roy Jones and James Toney are among the very few that might have topped him in the skill department. Of course none of those guys started at heavy if truth be told.

    I think a Byrd decision is a reasonable prediction. Can't see him stopping Carnera. But he spend a good part of his career dealing with big men and could box and move.
     
  5. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    It's probably the general consensus.
    So you're looking for leftfield alternative views. Hipster !
     
  6. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    :lol:

    But you mean they're mediocre for champions? Or do you think they both fought in mediocre eras?

    Between them they've got Holyfield, Vitali, Tua, Neusel, Loughran, Sharkey, Schaaf and some other good dudes. Nothing wrong with that.
     
  7. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Mediocre for champions, or worse.
     
  8. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Would you pick David Haye and Ruslan Chagaev to beat both? Or is it a matter of styles and ****, about the same?
     
  9. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Those four might be in the same ballpark, head to head. Byrd would probably beat Haye. Haye might knock out Carnera, but I give Carnera enough credit that he might survive some knockdowns against Haye, keep coming, and knock Haye out. Chagaev goes the distance, win, draw or lose, with Carnera and Byrd, close fights.

    So, I guess I'd say it's a matter of styles and ****, about the same.
     
  10. Seamus

    Seamus Boxing Junkie Full Member

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  11. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    So you see two of Wladimir's best wins as mediocre, is that right? Do you think he beat a fighter who was clearly in excess of these two in terms of excellence?
     
  12. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Yes. I think most would agree that Klitschko's opposition has been mediocre or average contenders. But, to be fair, he has quantity, consistency, dominance.

    He probably hasn't beaten anyone "clearly in excess" of those two.
     
  13. mcvey

    mcvey Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I think Byrd would comfortably out point Primo. I don't see many similarities between Loughran and Byrd. Loughran based his whole game around his jab ,jab and get away..Byrd was happy to work off the ropes with rolls and feints. Byrd's extra size gives him a much better chance against Carnera ,plus Loughran was a bit ring worn when he faced the Alp.
    Vitali is more akin to Willard than Primo,imo.
    Defensively Byrd was probably the most talented, but I think Page and Dokes for example had their own skill set.
     
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  14. janitor

    janitor Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I think that both are undoubtedly greater than Haye and Chagaev, and it would be a rash man who bet money on Haye or Chagaev beating either.

    As for the fight at hand, I suspect that Carnera would win a SD, and look ugly doing it.
     
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  15. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Yeah I agree that they're up there with his best.

    I don't agree that Byrd or Chagaev is mediocre though. I think both these guys are genuinely excellent heavies and the stuff that they could do with more of doens't prohibit them being very serious many in any era.

    I'd bet they, Carnera and Haye are among the 200 best fighters ever to compete in the open class. So they'd only be mediocre (as I understand the word) if you were doing a p4p comparison of all weights in all eras (kind of difficult...).

    Incidentally, would you say it is reasonable that as a talent, Wladimir hasn't proven himself much in excess of good given that he has only ever beaten mediocre fights, as you see it.