debunking the myth of louis being completely past it ...

I can only recall one notable Heavyweight being injured in the war, Tommy Gomez. Awesome puncher but never world class.

 

His great footwork was still intact and hadn't diminished as badly as the rest of his skills.
That is where Marciano gets sold short, his ability to close the gap and fire off shots when his opponents expected him to take another step .
He was anything but the come forward plodder he sometimes gets tagged with.

 

yeah it was a good victory in context, just not a loss that can be held against louis.

 

Joe Louis was past it when you compare it to his prime but he would still beat most if not all of today's top 25 with the exception of Vladimir and may beat today's version of Vital. As far as Tony Thompson, Povetkin,Helenius, and the rest he walks through, Haye has a punches chance and possibly Pulev styles but I am not sure they would get past that Joe

 

Louis wasn't totally past it.. but was clearly not the fighter he once was. Regardless, I think Rocky beats Joe.. prime for prime

 

my bad, guess its people trying to retroactivley look clever,

marciano/his people seemed happy enough rocky would win, this may also be talk from after the fight as well tho.

 

Which films specifically bear this out? In the films I've seen, he uses his right hand sparingly and without the same snap and power he showed back in his heyday.

Look at him against Lee Savold, which was one of the very few (maybe only?) genuine KOs he scored during his comeback:
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Louis fights almost exclusively one-handed for entire two-or-three minute stretches, even though Savold is standing upright and wide open for the right hand much of the time. And when Louis does throw his right, many of them look like chops. When the KO finally does come, it's from a hook, not a right.

His fights with Brion also show him using the right hand very sparingly.

 

No.

The world was very much sold on the idea of Charles, Louis and Walcott being the best in the world at that time. In that order. In 1951 Rex Layne beat Walcott then Marciano was matched with Layne with the winner getting Joe Louis to see if a new upstart meant anything. You have to remember Charles excited nobody. Once Louis beat Savold the #1 he was big news again and still winning. Whoever beat Louis was going to be the next big thing. Walcott beat charles around the time of the Louis v Marciano match.

 

Check out the Agramonte fight. Louis floors him with pin point expert right hands only months before the Marciano fight. Louis being one handed after the charles fight is a myth that just doesn't stack up. It is the worst kind of bull****.

 

Nothing wrong with old Joe Louis's right-hand against Marciano- Rocky simply did not give joe room to use it. watch the Agramote fight.

 

OK, here's the Agramonte fight.

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Admittedly, he does attempt the right hand more than in the other two fights I mentioned - but he still doesn't use it with any great consistency or regularity. In fact, in the 10th round, he fights an entire 2-minute stretch without throwing a single right hand - just alternating jabs and hooks.

Describing his right hands as "pin point expert" is rather generous, if not inaccurate. While he still showed flashes of power in the right, most of them were roundhouse and clubbing - not "pin point."

Louis had three other fights between this and Marciano, and the available footage of those show him using the right hand even less, with little or no efficiency.

And what about the Savold and Brion fights, in which he had plenty of room to use it, but didn't? What about the stretches in the Agramonte fight in which he also had room to use it, but didn't?

 

Louis always was a patient fighter even in his younger days he would stalk and stalk waiting to strike. It is a characteristic of his duller post-war form that there was a lot more waiting around before bursts of action. My point is here is the proof Louis was not one handed! You asked and I showed you.

Hes showing power and putting a decent fighter down with a right hand only months before facing Marciano. Look, I am not saying this is a peak Joe Louis but his results at this time compare with any world class contender.

The world rightly considered Louis as the second best active heavtweight in the world in 1951. Hed only lost to Charles, had already beaten Walcott and was taking out rated contenders again and knocking on the door for another title fight.

Only once Louis was knocked out leaving him nowhere to go was it posible to draw conclusions in tribute to the phenomenon the pre war Louis had been. Comeback Louis was no shell. He was still a capable world class fighter.

 

Whether patient or not, Louis had always used both hands equally. He was one of the best combination punchers that ever lived.

Also, his immediate post-war (pre-Charles) form was not necessarily "duller" than back in his prime. Here's footage of him mopping the floor with the world's #1 ranked HW in his 2nd post-war fight - and using both hands very vigorously.
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Even the footage you cited clearly shows him having problems using the right, which worsened in his subsequent fights before facing Marciano. In the last 2-and-a-half minutes of the fight, he throws approximately thirty jabs or hooks and only two rights. That's not being "patient," that's a clearly disproportionate punch variety.

If you want to discuss contemporary views of him, you'll find that his contemporaries also acknowledged his difficulties in using the right all through his comeback. One writer even commented that "It's as if his right never knows what his left his doing."

 

NO, I think you have latched onto the one handed myth and wont let go. The films show a capable two handed fighter. People said that but it was only in comparision to what Louis had been at his dazling best As a young stud. For a regular contender Louis was still a top performer. Outside of the champion, better than the rest until proven otherwise.Joe had adapted his econamy as older fighters often do - he was slower but he used feints and used less combinations - so what? He was not a one handed fighter. He was not broken. He was still a genuine world class contender. The film, facts and results speak for themselves.

 

i'll have to find that book which states he had very limited use of his right hand.rocky beat what was in front of him, but it was a shell of the original joe louis