Dempsey vs Wills article

Yes but bottom line Johnson went after it in a way they didnt'...Johnson was more a self made man Burns was as racist as anyone in America Johnson did what it took to get the shot..But he didn't make a titleshot a opportunity to his contemporaries..Dempsey get accused of having guys like Rickard help him get out of fighting Wills but Johnson never gets heat for not letting top contenders shots cause he's black..But if you had Langford champ maybe 6 months later Jeanette is champ maybe Johnson wins it back...Amazing times for boxing Don't say Johnson beat those guys already so it doesn't count
they improved and were deservedly worthy

 

Sorry, low hanging fruit is hard to resist.

And I ain't that young!

 

Mc. I respect your knowledge of boxing history and we don't differ too much EXCEPT though I would have loved if the Dempsey /Harry Wills bout eventually took place and Dempsey
kod Wills as Sam Langford attested too, what would some of his ESB bashers dig up to belittle him today ? And I will repeat the
legitimate fears boxing promoters were concerned with a mixed
HWT title bout between a black and white following the riots and deaths which occurred following the Johnson / Jeffries fight in Reno....Of course a fine chap like Harry wills suffered because of
those riots, but facts are facts MC. Ciao...

 

Burt,

I have not seen it every pointed out, but it is often forgotten that while Dempsey never actually fought Wills, he did KO the man who beat Wills. And on my understanding at least, even if you look for the controversy (low blows which have been pretty much proven wrong), He certainly did far better than Wills did.

If they had fought, it would have been around the timeof Wills' Sharkey loss or even the Uzcuden loss. Dempsey wipes the floor with this version of Wills. I think fighting Wills would do little for his ESB legacy. Just like Johnson who ducked McVey and Jeanette, despite dominating them in the ring.

 

It is a damning fact that Jack Dempsey was the world heavyweight champion for seven years and didn't fight Harry Wills, a top heavyweight contender almost the entire time. Yet there are some posters who defend Dempsey on this forum. At the same time, Joe Louis gets criticized on this forum for not defending his title against Lem Franklin and Elmer "Violent" Ray, two fighters who were contenders for only a very short time at best.

- Chuck Johnston

 

Hopefully, now you will have learned why, in days of yore they used to shoot the messenger.

I find it hilarious that the usual suspects, Kerry and Beinstock, are accusing you of all kinds of sh it , that you have NOT actually said in a detrimental manner about Dempsey.

 

I doubt there's a significant number of people criticizing Louis for not fighting Franklin and Ray.

i'd be surprised if there's more than one or two.

 

If Dempsey had defeated 20 mediocre challengers and still missed Harry Wills, he'd probably be largely forgiven. Wills would still be an enigma and an interesting issue but would have far less impact on the strength of Dempsey's reign. That's where Dempsey loses out to champs like Louis. His inactivity is stark in comparison, and then when people find out his few challengers were not even the best qualified contenders, it starts to look very weak indeed.

 

Almost as active as most of them perhaps.
I think Jeffries was quite active.

That's more or less true, and I would agree that Dempsey should not be criticized for it.
That was the whole point of holding the championship.
Milk it for what's it's worth.

But if we are to compare championship reigns in sporting terms, we can only compare what happens in the ring.
If Dempsey had twice as many successful defences (10 instead of 5, which wouldn't be overly active in a 7 year reign) his reign would be stronger.

 

For his time, Jack Dempsey was fairly active as a world heavyweight champion up to the time he fought Georges Carpentier in 1921. Afterwards, he was inactive for two years until he fought Tommy Gibbons and Luis Firpo. Then he was inactive for another three years until fighting Gene Tunney for the first time.

Yes, the world heavyweight champions generally weren't that active before Joe Louis came on the scene with Tommy Burns rightly being cited as a notable exception. I feel that you could also add Jim Jeffries to the list along with Burns.

It is true that many early world heavyweight champions didn't defend their titles very often because they could make money by going on the road. Dempsey made quite a bit of money going on the road and appearing in the movies. Another reason that a number of the early world heavyweight champions weren't that active was the legal difficulty in staging important bouts at the time.

- Chuck Johnston