Do you believe that IN GENERAL, fighters from previous eras were superior?

although boxing is in a slump and the aggregate ability is lower than in a previous decade, it doesnt mean that individuals arent as talented as ones in the past.

Roy Jones Jnr and Floyd are examples of those who could trade well in any era.


Perhaps fitness is dropping off generally with fights shortening. Perhaps stamina is not what it was now people are taking the car, train or bus everywhere instead of walking twenty miles into town even as children as it once was. Ging back far enough, Young adults used to work at an early age in manually demanding jobs that would rack up muscles on them. If you grow up doing that then you are going to be supertough without even trying by the time you reach adulthood.

 

Boxing was a mainstream sport decades ago meaning many more of are talented athletes went into boxing than today. Naturally, that would create a higher number of good boxers.

Quality wise, the best of our era could hold their own previous eras. They're not called ALL TIME Gs for nothing. Look at how people treat Mayweather, he's seen as a H2H Beast King.

You don't even have to go back too far to see the decline. Take Kostya Tszyu, Ricky Hatton, and Miguel Cotto(e). All of em are far from ATG status, but they all could clean house and **** the more recent 140 class of Bradley, Peterson, Amir, Ortiz, Rene, and Devon.

 

I think it's accepted that athletes, in general, are always getting better: bigger, stronger, faster.

Why would boxing be different?

 

He still won the heavyweight championship. Lucky or not he still did it and that's the difference compared to other sports and the real reason why your arguments are no good.
Boxing is such a different sport compared to anything else. One thing is that boxing doesn't have the gear and equipment which is getting better and better in other sports. The rackets in tennis, shoes and balls in football and the tracks in running. Jesse Owens ran on cinder for christ sake.

 

Why would it be the same?

What comparisons with track & field or other sports can you make?

24hr weighins allow modern fighters to be heavier but are they faster?
Are they stronger?
Do they punch harder & with better timing, accuracy & technique?
Do they have superior stamina?

 

There was quite an evolution in the first half of the 20th century. So when people talk about old-timers, there's a big difference between the likes of Jack Johnson & Jess Williard to the likes of Archie Moore & Joe Louis.

There's little doubt to me though that fighters in general were better a couple decades ago. Just watch the fights and look at their skills.

 

No.I classed 70's up as modern. Guys like SRR were simply boxers ahead of their time.

Jack Dempsey: 1910-20's

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJkiwu_04dw&feature=player_embedded[/ame]
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NN0vGHnCLo&feature=related[/ame]

VS Mike Tyson: 80's
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A42BzG80XWk[/ame]
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2cOtzA64ns[/ame]

Henry Armstrong: 30's
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZlEYrR7fIng[/ame]

VS Pacquiao: 2010
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JR3k7Fog_5c[/ame]


joe Louis: 1940's
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txDPVMmdNos&feature=related[/ame]

VS Lennox Lewis: 2000
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RC_C5eOyuuk[/ame]

Willie Pep: 50's
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2a_wt60Wn9M[/ame]

VS Mayweather: 2000
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywRJ5tnGNtI[/ame]


Now without bias. Pretend you dont know the names of those fighters. Sit down and watch the vids, can you honestly say the older fighters were technically better? Joe Louis followed Billy Conn around the ring like an amateur, plodding and outboxed by the much smaller man.

 

George Benton

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwYnF8SWNjs[/ame]

Floyd Mayweather

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKBgDk5wu40[/ame]

Do people think Floyd is more skilled & technically superior to Benton?

 

No he didn't. He won an ABC belt, not the HW championship.

In order to win the HW championship George would have needed a bit more than luck and hand-picked nobodies like Moorer and Schulz.

If I pull John McEnroe out of retirement and he beats Roger Federer who happend to suffer a freak injury does that mean classic era tennis players were superior? Because that's the perfect analogy of Foreman getting beat up by a fighter who's 25 lbs lighter than him for 10 rounds straight and then landing a single match-winning KO punch.

Using a freak-win, a single lucky punch as the base for your argument is truly pathetic :deal

 

that's a 'no' then

thanks for clearing that up

 

Ok, he won A championship, but that's not my point.
The point is that even if he had luck against a what you think was a nobody he still won which is almost impossible in other sports. Björn Borg came out of retirement in 1992 and was demolished by Jorge Arese who really was a nobody.
I'm not saying that yesterdays stars of boxing where superior to todays. I'm saying you can't compare boxings evolution with other sports because boxing is so different.

In boxing, things like Foremans win is possible, in other sports it's not. Which means that boxing hasn't evolved as much as other sports and is different as I already said.

 

let see what people respond with since Joe Louis is seen as THE textbook guy

 

No, this is a popular opinion IN CLASSIC. IN GENERAL, people are more in touch with reality.

 

correct. and you have to compare like with like. a fighter who fights once every 9 months, cancels fights when he has a mild cold, uses different equipment (boots, gloves) and earns enough money to dedicate himself full-time to his training, build his own gym, have a personal entourage and so on is in an entirely different position from many fighters in the past. not more skilled, not a better fighter, simply living in an entirely different environment.

when you watch blurred youtube footage of old-time fighters you have to remember those differences, imagine a modern fighter trying to perform in those conditions - imagine pbf fighting five fifteen-round fights in a calendar year against his closest challengers, see how slick he looks when asked to do that.

just to be clear, i think it's blindingly obvious that pbf would be a great in any era, that's not the point i'm making.

 

Modern athletes are superior in almost every aspect. It is hard to see in the team sports because both sides have advanced but it is obvious in individual competitions. The level of difficulty and technique in sports like gymnastics, figure skating, diving, etc is way beyond what it was 50 years ago. The same applies to boxing but it is hard for laymen to see because both fighters operate on much higher level than decades ago.