Does Sonny Liston divide opinion more than any other heavyweight?

You replied to my post with no content? Have You been pressing the wrong button again?

 

I’m not going to ask you to repeat yourself, (because I know how you hate to do that) but you said what I have to say about those two fights is borderline insane. Whilst I prefer “borderline” to outright insane, I have in the past said a great deal about these fights. Almost anything original could be interpreted as borderline insane. Mostly I agree with Angelo Dundee on the subject. It wasn’t luck. Liston had his number. And Floyd was psyched out both times. A bad combination for Floyd. Good for Sonny.

 

I've had problems with Internet Explorer and have been accessing the forum via Google Chrome.

 

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I have an awesome sense of perspective.
Which is when I share mine through tangible works, people connect with them in a deeply positive way.

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Furthermore, I've had arguments with Unforgiven over that very same issue.
Something tells me that he respected where I was coming from, and his outlook seems evolved.
Maybe your lowly standards are forcing people to use bum talk to fit in?
I can say with 100% certainty that this was the case for me.

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Making this abundantly clear for TMZ posters is an ongoing job, but here we go:
I'm not going to bat for my personal favorites.
I'm going to bat for objectively great boxers who's legitimacy gets questioned blithely by critics.

Thank god this forum respects Ali, or you'd see a whole new kind of wrath. Better believe that.
You got a little taste when you were being an apologist for Johnsons false conviction.

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Personal and unpleasant?
You telling me to suck dick was personal and unpleasant.
Only your feelings matter?

That's the point of having standards by design.
It allows a fair atmosphere where the moderator doesn't get to pick and choose who gets to insult who, especially giving himself all the privileges to insult others.

The super obvious solution: Just get of personal insults altogether.

Good, then keep going. Why did you stop?
You're saying you took care of the drivel about Ali and Greb, so why stop at Marciano?

You still haven't apologized to me for your dick sucking insults.
You don't deserve pleasantry.

Let me just make a quick message before I probably get banned:
If you want this forum to become way better, get rid of McGrain, or get him out of the way for now.
Let's get together and talk about some sensible new standards to ensure that posts remain respectful to other members and the subject.
Let's promote content, studies, projects with tangible results using crowd sourced research.
Let's get more people from the actual boxing community to post here through engaging content and by providing a comfortable atmosphere for them to do so.

I have a proven track record of creating a positive, informative, and engaging boxing community.
I would love to share my ideas in more detail that will help this place improve tremendously.

 

Those rankings are wrong. Choke once again picking and choosing whatever suits his agenda.

Those rankings he posted took place before London lost to Cooper.

When Patterson signed to fight London. London had dropped to 7th in the NBA ratings, and I believe but not sure out of the top 10 by RING.

 

Mcvey read my post above, choke is picking and choosing again. London was NOT number 2 by NBA when he fought Patterson


London fought Patterson in May of 1959

Here is RING Magazine February 1959

Champion Floyd Patterson

1. Ingemar Johansson
2. Nino Valdes
3. Zora Folley
4. Henry Cooper
5. Willie Pastrano
6. Archie Moore
7. Brian London
8. Eddie Machen
9. Sonny Liston
10. Mike Dejohn

 

This thread is ****ing madness.

A) because Sonny Liston isn't 1% as derisive as Deontay Wilder is today (and will likely continue to be in perpetuity and

B) because, well.

 

I wonder if he meant get rid of me? McGrain? McVey ? He asked for it before?
He is a decent lad, but way too sensitive, for , "the heartache and the thousand natural shocks that flesh is heir to".

 

It's from the ,"To Be Or Not To Be" soliloquy from Hamlet ," tis a consumation to be wished ,"and so on and so forth ,as Freddie Roach is fond of saying,but you knew that.

Perhaps I should have confined myself to the lower- brow spheres ie.

1. There’s a man going round, taking names. And he decides who to free and who to blame. Everybody won’t be treated all the same.” - Johnny Cash
   

 

Sadly Liston hadn't completed a full round of boxing for 3 years (2 years 11 months, but I'll say 3 years for the added dramatic effect) going into his bout with Ali and was on the slide way before he got into the ring with Patterson. That being said his body of work before he made it to the title is as good as any heavyweights in history apart from Frazier IMO.

Looking at the facts it really it shouldn't have been hard to see Ali was going to trounce him, but it seems the public view at the time was so heavily favoured towards Liston that it became one of the biggest upsets of all time, something that still baffles me to this day. That being said these views of mine are aided massively with hind sight.

The 2 Ali fights, his troubled lifestyle and public image are why he is so decisive, but to judge him solely on this is incredibly short sighted. Paying a lot cadence to any of them 3 when assesing Sonny as a fighter, in all honesty, is a little bit insulting in my view.