Does the title make the man or does the man make the title.

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by luke, Sep 2, 2012.

  1. luke

    luke Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I ask this because the WBO wasnt considered a 'big' title, but it had some of the best HW fights of the 90's, how did they attract the contenders to fight each other if the title wasnt a big one, at one point, Evander Holyfield was signed to fight for the WBO title against Tommy Morrison, but he lost to Michael Bentt (He was an amazing amature) then the WBO put him in against another person Morrison was signed to fight Herbie Hide (fight fell apart because the promotor couldnt pay the fighters, guys like Bruno & Mercer were also on the bill.) To put one of 'there' guys back in charge of the belt.


    Here is a list of the WBO fights from its start up untill the end of 2000, I've highlighted the better fights, higher hyped ones, and the ones with good contenders going at it.

    2000-10-14 Wladimir Klitschko - Chris Byrd
    2000-04-01 Chris Byrd - Vitali Klitschko
    1999-12-11 Vitali Klitschko - Obed Sullivan
    1999-10-09 Vitali Klitschko - Ed Mahone
    1999-06-26 Vitali Klitschko - Herbie Hide
    1998-09-26 Herbie Hide - Willi Fischer
    1998-04-18 Herbie Hide - Damon Reed
    1997-06-28 Herbie Hide - Tony Tucker
    1997-01-11 Henry Akinwande - Scott Welch
    1996-11-09 Henry Akinwande - Alexander Zolkin
    1996-06-29 Henry Akinwande - Jeremy Williams
    1995-06-17 Riddick Bowe - Jorge Luis Gonzalez
    1995-03-11 Riddick Bowe - Herbie Hide
    1994-03-19 Herbie Hide - Michael Bentt
    1993-10-29 Michael Bentt - Tommy Morrison
    1993-08-30 Tommy Morrison - Tim Tomashek
    1993-06-07 Tommy Morrison - George Foreman
    1992-05-15 Michael Moorer - Bert Cooper
    1991-10-18 Ray Mercer - Tommy Morrison
    1991-01-11 Ray Mercer - Francesco Damiani
    1989-12-16 Francesco Damiani - Daniel Eduardo
    1989-05-06 Francesco Damiani - Johnny Du Plooy


    Chris Eubank didnt fight the big name contenders, but nearly every one of His defences of the WBO 160/168 titles, were very dangerous.

    So what I'm asking is in this world of 10 world champs per weight division, Does the title make the man or does the man make the title?
     
  2. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace

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    A matter of perspective.

    A title brings prestige, wealth and recognition. It opens the doors to everything a boxer needs to justify his career choice.

    From my point of view as a fan, all I want is the best to fight the best. I'm not bothered whether the best holds the wbo, wba, wbc, ibo, ibf, ring or lineal. Ideally the individual claimants will unify the individual claims but it doesn't always happen.

    For instance I think gamboa is the best featherweight in the world today. He unified the wba and ibf then subsequently had both stripped off him. He beat the guy who, if i remember rightly, went on to claim the wbc title. Some dispute gamboa's claim to the wba title but I dispute John's before him as I never thought he deserved the decision v marquez.

    For me personally the man makes the title but for many other's the converse is true.
     
  3. TBooze

    TBooze Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    The man makes the title, period.

    It is 1989, and Mike Tyson is the Heavyweight Champion of the World. In June of that year, Francesco Damiani beats Johnny Du Plooy. On the strength of this, some call Damiani World Champion...
     
  4. The Funny Man 7

    The Funny Man 7 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    This isn't exactly to do with the WBO title but its connected.

    When Sandy Saddler beat Flash Elorde in a hugely controversial cuts TKO Nat Fleischer claimed that Saddler had completely devalued the 130 pound title. I don't think its a coincidence that the junior lightweight was considered one of the least prestigious title in boxing until the revival in the late seventies and early eighies with the glorious era of Limon, Arguello, Chacon, Camacho, Chavez eg.
     
  5. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace

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    another example comes to mind, in 97 Holyfield had beaten Tyson and Moorer to unify the division, but a tiny minority of people were calling Briggs the champion based on his gift v Foreman.
     
  6. janitor

    janitor VIP Member

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    History has often turned on a respected champion holding a given title.

    John L Sullivan did a lot to legitimise the gloved heavyweigh title for example.
     
  7. Titan1

    Titan1 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Goes both ways.I think Muhammad Ali did a lot for the heavyweight title(As did Larry Holmes for the IBF version). Then again, I think the WBA belt somewhat enhanced Hilmer Kenty, and Davey Moore.
     
  8. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member

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    I think it can work both ways, often winning a title gives a fighter an impetus to improve. Conversely a respected champ, such as Larry Holmes for example ,can give a minor alphabet title credibility.
     
  9. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    I called Du Plooy the champion. He was plainly robbed by the Anti-Boer contingent.