GGG vs James Toney at 160.

Stats are fine, but they don’t allow for context.

They don’t allow for circumstances.

They don’t allow for the quality of the opposition etc.

John Mugabi had awesome stats going into the Hagler fight. But he never beat a top level fighter in his entire career.

List GG’s wins and we’ll discuss them.

List me these ranked fighters.

We’ll put them under the same microscope that you have used for Tim Littles etc.

 

Answer your questions.

It is a FACT that GG didn’t have as many fights as Toney.

It is a FACT that he never fought in as many weight classes.

It is a FACT that GG hasn’t been as tested as what Toney was.

It is a FACT that GG didn’t have a schedule like Toney’s.

It is a FACT that the best fighters who GG fought in his prime, were NOT as good as Nunn and McCallum.

 

Hilarious.

 

The confirmation bias is rampant in this thread. I stand by my vote and think there is a good chance this fight ends in a draw. The way Golovkin's supporters are arguing, however, is preposterous.

 

The same thing with the Reggie Johnson fight.He claims fishy scorecards but he has not seen the fight
This guy clearly has his mind made up even BEFORE watching the fights

 

Mendoza ‘facts don’t care about your feelings’ Shapiro spitting nothing but flames

I’d go Toney is a close decision And GGG as a very live underdog. I do fancy GGG’s chances of an upset though, but I always have a thing for the underdog.

 

Questions early answered!

1 ) GGG had way more fights than Toney. He was 345-5 as an amateur plus he's not retired yet as a pro. Hence he has fought more rounds than Toney has in boxing.

2 ) No GGG has not moved up. He might and if he does it will be with the PED's Toney used. For shame.

3 ) GGG has too much for most people, even at an older age. No he wasn't floored or badly busted up vs non champions like Toney was, he never lost to a no name like Tiberi , nor did he struggle in close fights vs mere top ten types, or be outclassed as badly as Toney was! Too many facts to list.

4 ) As an amateur GGG was fighting 4-5 matches in a month. I've never seen anyone talk about a schedule in boxing, Toney was in shape and ready to go, his opponent didn't always have that luxury if he wanted to be paid.

5 ) Nunn would have beaten Toney in the re-match he was way up on points. I think McCallum at age 35 showed Toney's limitations in an official draw I think he edged as Toney was in his prime.

Let's look at Toney as he aged, he has some iffy performances and Losses. I have only talked about Toney in his prime to this point. Ya want to see how he did as he aged? GGG is 38.

We both agree GGG won the Canelo fights, we we are talking about an undefeated fighter here in his late 30's.

To add he was an all time puncher, who was never floored and always out landed his opponent in the punch stats. Only Oscar's judges prevent him from being un-defeated.

PS: Never have I seen such a crybaby or lame attempt to excuse a performance. I've been either talking boxing or posting about it for 20+ years. You take the cake. Toney lost to Tiberi. Your excuses are so funny, I might copy them down, log on to another site and watch how many laugh!

 

Do you want to score it with me? Stop running, let's do it. I find one judges cards off. Let me know. I look forward to it. Let's do it, we'll see how crooked of a judge you are. Also we will see Toney knocked down and badly cut in round 12. If I think Toney won it, I'll score it that way.

Deal?



" James (Lights Out) Toney retained his International Boxing Federation middleweight title this afternoon, surviving an early knockdown by Reggie Johnson to win a spirited 12-round split decision at the Las Vegas Hilton.

Judge Mike Glienna scored the bout for Johnson, 114-113, while the other judges, Ricardo Days (114-113) and

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The loser disputed the decision. "There's no doubt in my mind: I felt I won the fight," Johnson said. "It hurts me because I work so hard. I'll be back." Toney Admits His Surprise "

 

He was an underdog type, often behind on the cards as he simply was not that good of a boxer. Cut / swelled up badly, or floored in different matches. None of the above happened to GGG.

Like I said Toney is a poor out-fighter, open to the jab and hit by theta punch too many times. It's on film to see in multiple fights.

I pull for the underdog too at times, but not when he's a racists, with a criminal background who abused PED's. I take it his fans don't want to touch those points. The underdog in the movies is very opposite to who Toney was. If he was the same, nobody would pull for him, except those like him.

Or you can pull for Jimmy Braddock.

 

It is not. You talk about cards being BS but you haven't watch the fight, You are full of it. Same thing with the Mc Callum-Toney fights, you talked BEFORE even wtatching them Then you turn upo with some biased minority view card

 

Toney by PTS.

 

You haven’t answered my questions.

All you do is twist them to suit your agenda.

I don’t care about amateur fights.

Either do me the courtesy of answering my exact questions, as I have answered yours, or don’t bother replying.


1. Has GG had the same hectic PROFESSIONAL schedule as what James Toney did?

2. Has GG been tested in the way that Toney was?

3. In his prime, did GG fight anybody as good as Michael Nunn and Mike McCallum?


I don’t care if you think that Nunn would have won a rematch. And you have to give him credit for beating Nunn, even if he was behind on the cards at the time.


What excuses have I made for the Tiberi fight?

James admits that he lost.

All I’ve said, is that James wasn’t at 100%, where he fought to his full capabilities. Yes, he was in his prime. But he wasn’t focused. He wasn’t motivated.

Jackie Kallen said that he was distracted and that he’d had to go to hospital afterwards because he was dehydrated.


Now I’d like to ask you 2 final questions: (Again, I have answered all of yours)

1. If you think that Toney was at 100% where he fought to his full capabilities against Tiberi, then please explain to us how he was able to beat: Nunn, Mike, Reggie, Barkley, Thornton, Littles, Williams and Jirov? (10 years later)

2. If BJS was unfocused against Akavov, (that’s your own opinion) then why couldn’t Toney have been unfocused against Tiberi?

 

Toney UD (8-4/9-3). Canelo has a similar style to Toney & he had a lot of success against GGG in both fights - regardless of who you thought won. He effectively neutralised GGG attack & made him hesitant to fully come forward. Toney does everything Canelo does except better. He hits harder, is better defensively, is a better counter-puncher, has better footwork & stamina. If a smaller Canelo can have that much success - then Toney wins handily.

 

Sounds reasonable. Toney would beat up Canelo too. Both Canelo and GGG are not quite in JT's and Mike Mc Callum class.

 

Oh for sure, although Canelo will have his moments - like GGG, but not many.