The earliest radio broadcast of a boxing match that exists is Dempsey-Tunney 1927 recorded a year after Greb's death by placing a microphone up to radio reciever and recording it directly to disks.
I don't know more about Bogash than you do - but i've opened at least one thread about him on the board and done such reading as is available to me - if this leaves me with an opinion of Bogash that is contrary to yours, that's something worth addressing, but if my ignorance of Bogash should happer my discussing him, then he should never be discussed on the board, because it's arguable that only two posters up until this point have demonstrated as keen an interest in him as me after 2007. Yes; i've always been clear that I consider Greb to have won in spite of reports to the contrary. That's my reading of that fight. I remember SLAKKA who is likely another poster with a deeper knowledge of Bogash than I have complimenting upon digging up this point of view on my own when there is evidence to the contrary. You imply here that the New York papers are flat out in for sabotaging Greb though. If Bogash-Greb was NOT close, these "anti-Greb" sportswriters were not fudging the scoring but rather out to lie about Greb in a fight that was won "handily" by Greb. This is a serious accusation to levy at The New York Times. Perhaps you can shed a little more light on the matter? As I've pointed out. As i've pointed out. No. I want to argue that KG is my pick for the second best welterweight of whom we have extensive film and I favour him over more welterweights of whom we have extensive film than any other welterweight outside of Robinson. This being the case, I don't much like Bogash's chances, standing, as he is, at 5'5. I also think that his aggressive style is absolutely taylor made for KG's style of boxing. KG has a serious physical advantage and is brilliant. "Of all people"? What? No. A stain on his career? A clue to help us understand him. Your case is definitely plainly put, i'll say that. If you want to go ahead and ignore every fight Greb ever had after developing sight difficulties in evaluating his head to head status as a fighter, you really will struggle to paint an accurate picture.
Are we certain that this is the earliest extant broadcast? It seems incredible that Dempsey-Carpentier does not exist anywhere, or Tunney-Dempsey I, or Tunney-Gibbons. (There's a brief shot of the announcer in the Gibbons footage.) [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2-QwAbP6Yw[/ame]
Patently false statement itrymariti---As far as i can recall i have twice participated in a Fantasy match except for the Harry Greb /Ray Robinson H2H which I happen to believe Harry Greb with his strength and style would have prevailed over the equally great Ray Robinson---- And when I chose Jack Dempsey [PRIME ],because of his Arturo Godoy somewhat style with enourmously more firing power,beating the great Joe Louis...Because of what I envision in my minds eye! My picks have NOTHING in the world to do with old timer nostalgia...For a good reason, I am only eighteen years old... I also believe Pep would have licked Terry McGovern. I also believe Ezzard Charles would beat Tommy Loughran. I also believe fervently that Joe Louis would have beat the Johnson, Jeffries , Corbett, crowd, I can go on and on...I have no DOG in the race,nor agenda...And in my long lifetime,picking fight winners, I have been more right than wrong... So I trust my inate instincts, when pondering the abilities of fighters of the past and present...
Yes, to answer your question there were certain New York newspapermen who were outright hostile towards Greb and as such I consider their reporting suspect at best. There are several reasons for this, some were simply biased towards New York or east coast fighters and Greb was never really a part of that click, secondly some reporters simply didnt like his style, third several reporters approached Greb once and demanded that he pay them money in order for them to right positively about him and his chances against Dempsey. Greb, or rather a Pittsburgh newspaper writer, via information from Greb spilled the beans on that little detail and caused something a storm. Greb quickly changed his tune when he saw that the powerful New York press were all lining up against him, and finally many of those reporters were literally in the pocket of managers and promoters who were hostile to Greb such as Billy Gibson, manager of Gene Tunney. So basically, yes, when Greb fights Bogash in a competetive match and the winner is being offered a shot at Siki by the promoter, and all unbiased ringside reports state that Greb won fair and square, and the promoter goes on trying to match Siki with Greb and not Bogash with Siki, I think its a little odd when 2 New York newspapermen who had been hostile to Greb almost as a knee jerk reaction everytime his name appears in print file unflattering accounts of the fight and hit the AP or UPI newswires with them. I dont know why this should surprise anyone. Sportswriters are still dirty today and still play favorites with certain promoters. You can go down the line of top boxing writers and tell by who they write about most, where they get their information, and who they regularly attack that they are in bed with X, Y, or Z. Hell, Ring magazine, the most famous boxing publication in the world is OWNED by a promoter and was in fact founded by New York sportswriters from that era who in all likelyhood werent above taking a kickback here and there to talk a fighter up or down.
Ray actually tested the waters vis a vis a fight with Archie, even having him and his Wife over to dinner to discuss it ,but it fell apart because Ray wanted all the money, not for the first time.
What is the evidence that the two New York writers were biased against Greb? What other supposed one-sided Greb victories did they find against him in, Tunney aside? So the LA Times ("Greb whipped by Bogash"), Chicago Tribune(Bogash Beats Greb), The Halford Courant ("Bogash shades Greb") are all victims of the NY wire ("Bogash Beats Greb")? What do you make of the The Boston Daily Globe report which had Greb-Bogash a draw? This is obvioulsy not form the New York Times wire, having the fight a draw rather than a loss. Another biased reporter? Or and honest eye to a close fight?
Against Tunney ,Greb was never within the middle limit, Greb Tunney 165 1/2 174 162 174 1/2 166 175 171 1/2 175 162 1/4 174 1/2 167 181 Greb Loughran 168 168 168 166 166 166 168 1/4 166 167 163 1/2 168 168 1/2 Greb conceded weight to Tunney, but he was allways over the limit as a middle. Loughran only once exceeded Greb in weight ,and only by half a pound . I take Harry to win a close dec,but anyone picking Robinson should not be castigated imo,.They were both ATG's,and vie for the title best P4P, along with Armstrong, Langford and Fitz.
Yes Greb when he fought these bigger men was over the 160 pound limit for a good reason...He was not fighting for the 160 pound title...Why torture himself to make the weight when he did not have to ?Makes no sense... But when in his last year Greb fought Mickey Walker, and later on Tiger Flowers twice, Greb came in at about 159 pounds,for the bouts...He was a middleweight fighter when he was required to be when he fought for the 160 pound title...Just as so many others including Jake LaMotta whose walking around weight was 170lbs...What fighter including Greb would sacrifice a couple of good meals when he was not legally bound to make any weight,as long as he felt ok ? One other point..I have never castigated any thinking poster who picks Ray Robinson over Greb, except when they use the old bromide of "well I have never seen films of Greb ",therefore he was not as good as Robinson. Ignoring the opinions of everyone who saw him at his zenith, and overlooking al the great Hall of Famers Greb whipped repeatedly... This gets my dander up...
I was not referring to you when I mentioned the term castigate, its just that some posters on this thread have become very dogmatic on their pick,personally I go for Greb ,but anyone who writes off SRR's chances against ANY man near his own weight is selling Robinson short ,imo. I have read that Greb had a hell of a time making the weight for the Walker fight and, consequently, had to uncharacteristically pace himself in the early going .Possibly Klompton will charge in now, and tell me I am talking out of my rectum . He may well be the resident authority on Harry Greb, no one has challenged it ,but his manner of debate can be abrupt and ,shall we say undiplomatic.
I am not an authority on Harry Greb, just a devotee..But I have read that to make the weightfoir Mickey Walker ,Greb ran around the Central Park reservoir,a couple of times, and drank orange drinks after...He took a good pounding at the beginning of the fight, and probably got his second wind. and the rest is history...Grebs resume' is almost surreal, it seems...b.b.