Has Foreman vs Marciano been done?

You are so right about the Frazier-Marciano comparison - in fact I would go as far to say that they were actually completely different fighters with completely different styles - Frazier was IMO (although a great fighter in his own right) very limited in comparison with Marciano - he did walk right into Foreman...RIGHT INTO FOREMAN. Marciano would never walk right into Foreman - he never walked right into anyone. Frazier, it could be said, fought as stupid a fight as it is possible to fight against Foreman. But to be honest he didn't look to me to have a great idea what he was doing a lot of the time anyway?? Even in his most imipressive fights it was all literally taking shots until he could muster up enough steam for his left hook - he really did walk into and through thousands of shot just to get in one of his own (which is probably why he's the way he is now) - which is something people describe Marciano as having done a lot of the time - but Marciano never did this - it is a complete fallacy - Marciano was a lot more controlled and poised in his approach compared to Frazier - there is no comparison whatsoever - and he wasn't a left hooker - which is what Frazier whole game was worked around - Marciano also had much more one punch power - Frazier usually needed to build up a head of steam with a couple of set up shots before the coup de grace - IMO Marciano was in a completely different league to Frazier - I think every fight for Marciano with anyone in the top ten would be really really tough fights - as hard if not harder (if in different way's) than his fight with Walcott for the title but he just took his time and would be capable of finding a way to win against them all inside the 15 round limit.

 

While I am a big Marciano fan and can see why Lewis and Foreman can be an early danger I also did not like Foreman in fights where he had to fight a puncher, Lyle almost had him out and Lyle was strong but nothing in his record indicates he was a killer.

Lewis was more accurate and an early danger to Marciano but both men(Lewis and Foreman in there prime lacked stamina in a fight that they were pressured boxed instead of mixed

We all look at the Frazier fight but Frazier was stunned by Terry Daniels and Ron Stander and Ali in fights around that time and seemed like he had seen better days

Hard to say how Foreman would have reacted to a well timed bomb on the chin or a relentless puncher coming after him after he shot his load

Dangerous fights but Foreman ducked Quarry and as big as he was I feel Quarry had a good chance to pull the upset.

Both Lewis and Foreman are dangerous fights early for Marciano but as the fight goes on it gets dangerous for the big men. Lewis never stopped a man after the 8th and Foreman was dropped from being tired by Young and Ali and dropped from being wide open and easy to hit by Lyle, Lewis was KO'd cold by 2 men and I think Marciano could hit Harder than Lyle,McCall or Rahman....These fights can be tough for Marciano but I would not be surprised if he pulled it off

 

exactly. its a bad match for foreman.

 

This is one of the worst match-ups for Marciano

Even the biggest Marciano fan I know, rooster4life, concedes that this is the only fight that really does not look good for Rocky

 

based on frazier and norton wins I asume?

 

Marciano was either too far away or too close for a big puncher to hit him with a decent punch. He was just a different beast from the rest of the HW champions. Watch this video keeping distance in mind, and then please explain how the slower George Foreman would land a good punch on Marciano:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WzxU7943E3k[/ame]

 

I'm assuming based on styles. Those wins have a lot to do with vindicating my feelings, but they are not the deciding factor.


Rocky liked to push against his opponent. He was a bulldozer. But I see Foreman as probably the only one Rocky wouldn't have his way with in terms of forcing his body against his opponents. Foreman could push him back is he wanted to. Also Rocky duck under the jab often. You can see it in the Louis fight above. That is suicide against Foreman. George would throw the jab, and as soon as Rocky start to duck he would fire his right uppercut. And if doesnt land 9 times. It will, the 10th time.


Theres not a fighter in history who I believe would have an easy time with the Rock, but Foreman is as close as they come.

 

When he fought Foreman the first time, Frazier was 10 pounds fatter than when he beat Ali. And the problem was also the Frazier didn't crowd Foreman. Also, the ref allowed Foreman to push Frazier away every 5 seconds, instead of taking points away.

In Frazier's place, Marciano 1) would have trained seriously for the fight, 2) would have kept his head on Foreman's chest for long periods, which would have given him a huge power advantage because of his very short arms, and 3) would have kept his chin tucked in, instead of having it in the air where Foreman could whack it while he was coming in. Marciano's defense is very similar to Floyd Mayweather's: very difficult to land flush on his chin.

 

Joking aside, I never found two fighters who were not completely different fighters with completely different styles.

Marciano = Frazier may be a reasonable starting point for understanding this fight, but it should only ever be a starting point.

Further analysis is definitely necesary.

 

foreman was a big dangerous puncher but still very raw when at his best. he was not yet a complete fighter. To beat marciano you would need to be a complete fighter.

frazier was shopworn, ripe pickings for any fresh young talent when foreman got him and Norton couldnt fight going backwards and had been exposed earlier in his career. These two wins flatter george who was still (as ali proved) a work in progress. The talent and raw material was there enough to beat a norton and tired frazier but not agaist a prime all time great like marciano.

marciano would maul his way in from a feint at a low angle. I doubt foreman could time counters fast enough to catch him from above as well as walcott did on the way in at a beter angle. if he did theres lots of evidence that marciano had the ability to withstand punches as well as gergorio peralta did against foreman.

 

good point. Its a lot of hogwash that the sheer size of "big george" is just too much for marciano. like george is some king kong the size of a giant sky scraper with wrecking balls attached at both sides and rocky some pathetic elf.

peak foreman was a mere 3 pounds heavier and an inch taller than joe louis was in their fight. old Joe louis is roughly the size of young george foreman.

 

Maybe Foreman's completeness as a fighter would not be necessary. And yes Marciano withstands punishment like nobody else. That's why I think the likes of Foreman, the most powerful fighter ever, would be the kryptonite of Rocky.

And did Frazier really seem that off to you in the fight? He seemed to be fighting very well if you ask me

 

Marciano was a very different fight than Frazier and Frazier that fought Foreman was already a different fighter than the one that fought Ali. I have never seen Marciano hurt in a fight but have seen Frazier stunned and dropped and Joe only had 26 fights going into Ali and 29 fights going into the Foreman fight, Joe's record from the Foreman fight on was 3-4-1 giving him a final record of 32-4-1...I love Frazier but I seen him rocked and hurt in many fights with only his heart getting back to business, lets face it he had heart and got up 6 times against Foreman. I don't think George would be able to be as effective vs Marciano and Rocky had 2 hands for George to watch. I could see a wide open Big George get blasted by a right hand hook and go down like he did vs Lyle but Marciano would not tire like Ron did.

Foreman brings danger but so does Marciano and I would not be surprised if Marciano, got on the inside and in his side angled crouch and KO'd Foreman

 

Really good post. Lots of valid points here. Physical differences aside, Rocky is at a disadvantage because Foreman would be hard for him to get to. And there is also Foreman's shoving to contend with as well. Charley Goldman must find a way around that, and Rocky must hone his defensive skills.

Like you said, I also think Rocky has a chance if he can slip under those swinging jackhammers. If he can get close enough to the ribs and pound away, Rock may be able to tire George out.

 

nortons and frazier's jaw did not rank close with marciano's.