I'm curious, do you think the majority of top fighters have been on peds? I honestly don't know, there are so many different views out there. Also, who do think is the best of Holyfield's era, record-wise & H2H?
It’s the HW division. It’s the 80s-90s… he juiced, Mike juiced, Lennox juiced…. FFS they’re pro athletes with tens of millions sometimes hundreds of millions of dollars at stake. They had every reason to abuse roids and if you think otherwise your naive.
Aren't there multiple reports of NFL/UFC guys going on rampages abusing their girlfriends and it's partly attributed to roid rage? I've heard similar things in regards to police officers who are on the juice trying to live out action movie fantasies going way overboard apprehending people.
I don't like to accuse a fighter, or any other athlete of steroid use, unless they have failed a drugs test, or other strong evidence has emerged against them. I am a distance runner, and being a cheat in the marathon running community, is a bit like being a rat in the mafia. It is not an accusation that you would throw at somebody lightly. Now in Holyfield's case, I think that the evidence that he used steroids, would very likely stand up in court.
Yes, and those stories may well be true. However not every PHD affects people in the same way, and not everybody is affected by them in the same way.
But my problem is, do I just assume everyone does it? Do I look at the fighter that's in incredible shape & automatically think he's juicing? So many people say JMM was on peds when he scored the KO on Pacquiao, or that Holyfield was on them against Tyson - and their wins seem tarnished now. Oh well, I'm getting tired of saying it, but it's Yet Another reason why boxing was so much greater back in the 'old days'.
Huge difference. Tyson was a natural HW, and a genetic freak in terms of how much muscle he naturally carried. Holyfield wasn't.
Something was definitely up with Tyson when he got out of prison. He never looked like he did in that first post-prison fight, before or after. Maybe it was just solid weight training that he later gave up?
I know this. This was literally my entire point. That even at tweleve years old he was 180-190lbs of muscle. Did you even read the quote I was responding to?
Yes, some people who get PHDs after finishing college become well adjusted, mild mannered individuals while others still retain their toxic qualities. But to address what you said, peds/drugs/alcohol etc simply enhance things that are already there. For example, drugs that alter the user's perception of reality may have an even more negative effect on people with delusions/schizophrenia etc. Similarly, if someone is a violent individual who can't keep their hands to themselves, roids may make it worse as they can increase testosterone/aggression etc. But someone who is mild mannered and calm can simply channel that extra energy into their given sport without being chaotic.
Tyson wasn't allowed to lift in the Indiana prison since there weren't any weights in that particular prison. Not sure how much he kept in shape but he did lose muscle mass. But that's natural when you sit around for 3 years. I heard somewhere, maybe it was a conversation I had with Steve Lott when he was alive, that Tyson rarely lifted weights and mostly hit the heavy bag, speed bag, the willy, ran and sparred. He did lift weights, just nt as much post prison. It's obvious and you can tell Tyson lifted weights post prison, though.
I read somewhere that all Tyson could do in prison was run, push ups, and shadow box, he probably figured out some kind of crunches or ab work he could do too, but it said that he was like 190 when he got released and that's why he was so surrounded and covered up they didn't want him to be seen being so small there were ~4.5 months between him being released and that "first official workout" and he fought McNeeley 3 days later, he was a lot more ripped than we've ever seen him he definitely had a bit higher body fat in the 80's, he weighed 220, so if 190 coming out of prison is true that's 30lbs of nothing but muscle put on in 4 months, those kind of natural gains would require a diet that would have put more fat on him too
I guess another aspect of peds that I don't ever see being mentioned are the now illegal fat burners of the 90's full of ephedrine, it's possible Tyson took those and ate enough to gain that muscle, but I think he still would have needed something for recovery, definitely no hgh or bulkers though, there is really only that 4 months that is questionable, it could be that he took some stuff then and stopped by the time of his "first official workout" so he can technically say that during his career he never took anything, he was already a lot more natural looking by his first meeting with Holyfield Holyfield achieved that crazy bench press and arguably his peak as far as being a muscular beast because he knew he had to hang with Tyson, and well, he handled Tyson, but I don't think that Holyfield overcomes 80's Tyson, Tyson was arguably at his post prison peak during Holyfield 1, but his 6-4 that got replayed and still stung Holyfield was so puny compared to the 6-4 Ribalta ate