yeah thats the point...he had all of what you mentioned and look who he made a career of fighting.....he ought Jones and lost...he was around the same time as alot of the following...and maybe only a weight division away but they all started out and were considered true middleweights ...McCallum, Toney, Benn, Eubank, Collins, Julian Jackson, McClellan, Michael Nunn, Iran Barkley....but did manage to fight Echols 2 times, Mercardo 2 times and robert alle 3 times...