How To Use The Jab

I have a jab question arising from conversations with two of you gentlemen via PM.

Both in his book and apparently sometimes as part of his normal approach, Joe Frazier seemed to plant his left foot when throwing the left hook, and push off with his rear (right) foot. As I understand it, this is the reverse of the typical way the left hook is done.

@Pat M characterized doing this as not throwing a left hook at all, but a "bent armed jab."

My questions would be:

- Were Frazier's version of left hooks bent-armed jabs, or should they still be considered left hooks?

- Did anyone else throw a "jab" like this? Is it used by other boxers?

- Is throwing this kind of punch useful, or are fighters better served by more conventional ones? Are there any advantages to throwing it that way? (Aside from it being better suited to Frazier's long-injured arm, I assume.)

 

JF was successful and if that's what he did, it worked for him. A typical hook involves a pivot with the left foot and a transfer of weight to the right foot. If JF really threw his left hook and kept his weight on the front foot, he'd probably have been more powerful and balanced with a weight transfer to the rear foot. From what you are describing I'd consider that punch more of a bent armed jab than a true hook.

We had a southpaw who threw a right hook that way. It still was a hard punch, but it would have been much harder if he transferred his weight. I saw a video of him in a street fight later (after he stopped boxing) and he hit a guy who had a big, block head with his right hand, he knocked the guy out on his feet but didn't knock him down. When I saw him I told him I saw the video and he still left his weight on the front foot. It probably saved the guy he was fighting some medical bills.

 

In my know nothing opinion If you throw your hook off of your lead foot with no shift of weight the pivotal point becomes your front leg so it castrates your right.
I also think when you throw it this way you lose concussive force because your weight isn’t “whipped through” rather “at” if that makes sense?

 

It does make sense. And also puts Frazier's fights into an interesting light, since it explains how he wasn't known for having much of a right, how Ali absorbed so many "left hooks" without going down, etc. It also fits with how Frazier's arm was apparently injured in a way that prevented him from fully extending it in a jab; maybe Frazier wouldn't have developed his left pseudo-hook if he hadn't needed a jab substitute.

Does throwing a left pseudo-hook / bent arm jab like that allow the person doing it to double up on the hook easily? The weight transfer sequence seems like it would be the same as a regular jab-hook combination: lead foot planted with hip rotation and back leg pushing off, followed by the weight going slightly back while the front foot rotates.

 

I don’t think it makes it easier or faster I think functionally you probably can still double up.
I don’t think there is a con to punching properly or a useful pro to doing otherwise - you can be faster slapping and cuffing the way a lot of speedsters have or you can punch short the way Louis did and hurt people.
Shifting your weight is bedrock foundational stuff. Think of this if you aren’t punching from the hips (shifting the weight) your head won’t move or it will but minimally. That is very important for certain attacks.
Even Frazier defence his ducking and rolling do you notice the consistent separation between when he’s attacking and when he’s avoiding punches?
I think Frazier might be a good example of what @greynotsoold has spoken about where guys take turns punching (clarify if I’m wrong my friend)
Think about this too… if you throw your left hook and you want to weave correctly - you slide your left foot left when the rear leg has the weight then you chase that weight to hit them with a right uppercut to the body on the way through - If you tried it with all the weight on the front leg what happens?
Note I am not the best communicator and am willing to clarify but I am a know nothing so please perhaps check with the knowledgeable responses to this post.

 

Another problem with leaving the weight on the front foot will occur if you miss the left hand. If you let your weight transfer to the right foot and miss you can push off the right foot "roll" back under to your left and do it again. You'll be balanced and in a strong position. But if your weight is on your left foot (front), it would be difficult to reset. A miss would probably leave you hanging in a position where the other guy can counter with a right hand.
Leaving the weight on the front foot may also make the person more likely to let his head get past his knee. That affects balance and will leave a person vulnerable defensively. Some people make something they do wrong "work" for them, but just because it worked for them doesn't mean that someone else should copy it or teach it to others. Good body mechanics and technique will give a person an edge over the guy who makes something work that he is doing wrong.

 

Let’s keep this one alive or at least on the front page for some curios fellas there is some pretty good stuff here.

 

@Pat M
@greynotsoold
@Saintpat

Would you three have some jabbing performances you’d like to submit? There was a great McGirt fight where he fought one handed, one I liked a lot, I want to say it was against Bermudez?

 

@Rockin1 Could I ask you a question? What changed in how you used your jab as a pro compared to as an amateur for you personally?

 

Michael Spinks is a great one to study. Uses it more as a fencer/boxer vs. Qawi, uses it like bludgeon vs. Ramon Ranquillo (he almost jabs the guy’s face off).

 

Another suggestion is Brian Mitchell, the splendid South African junior lightweight champ. I can’t remember which fight, but there’s one where he’s obviously wanting to outbox the opponent and maintain a certain distance and he finishes every combo with a jab to reestablish his spacing.

So instead of a 1-2, he throws a 1-2-1, etc. After every exchange, he’s back exactly where he wants to be. It’s a very high-ring-IQ use of the jab not only to score but to maintain the zone from which he wants to work.

 

@greynotsoold I watched a good bit of Spinks-Ranquillo. You have to be patient to find spots where you get to see his legs when he jabs but Michael with this shotgun jab pushes off the ball of his right foot and you can see how much of his left shoulder gets behind the jab — it’s not an arm punch at all.

Couple of other things I like:

1) He uses it at all ranges, including way inside the pocket and always throws through the target. He’s not trying to tap Ramon on the nose … he’s trying to push his nose clear through to the back of his head. He throws it multiple times at shorter range than you’d expect a jabber to throw it, and with great effect.

2) Just often enough, Spinks will throw that jab to the chest and land it with a thud. I think the first time I noticed he missed a couple jabs to the head and the next one landed right in the middle of his chest … no way to miss if you aim there — you’ll hit something. And it is also a good way to get a guy to try to parry with his left so you can throw the right behind it and catch the opponent unguarded.

Spinks’ jab is a thing of devastating beauty.

 

You need to bait them into thinking they’re out of range them pop them with it, vary the speed of the jab to get them accustomed to a slower speed, vary your hand position, vary levels, vary the intensity of your movement, relax for a second to make it look as if you’re resetting, then pop it out, feint, make the step back then when they step into range, throw it then, people think that just because they’re resetting, that the opponent won’t throw.

 

In with trying to keep this thread alive @greynotsoold does this count as a way to use the "Jab"? starts at 41:37 (When Pieere throws the right)

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