IN time can pavlik be another hagler??

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by jgorst05, Sep 11, 2008.

  1. RealIzm

    RealIzm Boxing Junkie banned

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    Pavlik is more similar to Tommy Hearns in my humble opinion, Pavlik is certainly gaining polish. Pavlik can certainly box and box well, he proved this in the 2nd Taylor fight....Like Hearns Pavlik has a long and stiff jab and sweet and concussive right hand. One difference may be is Pavlik isnt as quick on his feet, or maybe as defensive minded. However as he progresses the similarities may become more clear
     
  2. RealIzm

    RealIzm Boxing Junkie banned

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    Thats a load of horse****:fire
     
  3. Loewe

    Loewe internet hero Full Member

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    Nah, he isn´t anywhere similar to Hagler. Pavlik is a one dimensional accumulation puncher, perhaps an unconventional swarmer with very heavy hands. His best weapons are his power, stamina and number of punches but he lacks defence, ring generalship, footwork and chin. He may be go down as a very good middleweight but imo he lacks too much to become an atg.
     
  4. fidds

    fidds Boxing Addict Full Member

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    The Beatles ko 1 Jonas Brothers :lol:

    No i don't think Pavlik can im afraid but hey everyone's a critic huh
     
  5. RealIzm

    RealIzm Boxing Junkie banned

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    He lacks ring generalship?:huh He has a decent chin, decent footwork, and decent defense....The attributes you highlighted are indeed his weapons however you left out his jab, which apparently is abit underrated.....I was just little curious as I feel he IS the ring general, at least I feel he's way above average in that category as I can't think of one fight where he hasnt dictated the action or pace, is usually always in the center of the ring or bullying his opponents towards the ropes.......so do explain his lack of ring generalship.......Thanks
     
  6. Loewe

    Loewe internet hero Full Member

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    Nah, coming forward throwing punches is not ring generalship. Pavlik never was in there with a great ring general, Taylor was the best there and he didn´t really make Taylor fight his fight that was about even and Taylor got manhandled by Hopkins in the ring general department. His jab is good but nothing special, there are many who have a better or as ggood of an jab as him. Like you said his chin, footwork and defence is decent that´s not enough to become a great fighter. If somebody has only a decent defence and decent chin he sooner or later will get laid out. I can´t see any mw right now who has the tools to become an atg, Abraham has the tools Pavlik misses but lacks workrate and skill.
     
  7. RealIzm

    RealIzm Boxing Junkie banned

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    Perhaps I've been paying attention to him for a while longer and have noticed steady progression...for the record many ATGs have merely been decent in 1 or 2 departments and excel in others.....I'm sorry but "Coming forward throwing punches is not ring generalship" won't be your crowning quote of the day as I'm afraid theres abit more to it than that.......In essence your saying that a pressure fighter can't possibly be a ring general......Pavliks game is based around a solid jab, pressure and hasnt been in a fight where he hasnt been the ring general.......what exactly makes a good ring general in your opinion?? For me its the ability to dictate the pace of the fight, and being able to fight however you choose, usually the said fighter has control of the center of the ring, unless of course he's battering his opponent on the ropes. The Hopkins fight will tell us more
     
  8. mexican legend

    mexican legend MVP! Full Member

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    I doubt it.
     
  9. catasyou

    catasyou Lucian Bute Full Member

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    :yep ,it is hard to reach the level of the Marvelous one:hail
     
  10. Loewe

    Loewe internet hero Full Member

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    The first 3-4 rounds of the Hopkins fight Pavlik will do what Hopkins want him to do, after that it will be all Pavlik because Hopkins is too old.

    Duran was a good ring general. He made Leonard fight his fight even though Leonard had the ability to fight, and win, otherwise. Did Pavlik ever do that to anyone? What Hopkins did to Winky in there fight was great ring generalship, he took away his strength, workrate, jab, and found a way to work around his defence. Perhaps I just have a higher standard than you.
     
  11. Sweet Pea

    Sweet Pea Obsessed with Boxing banned

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  12. Executioner

    Executioner Boxing Addict Full Member

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    simple answer
     
  13. platnumpapi

    platnumpapi Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    all he has to do is keep on winning ! they second he loses people who say "i told you so" he could be better then hagler i think ! lets say he beats bhop and then the winner of joe and roy (which is joe) he could be at the very least mentioned as a candiate for best mw ever, let alone hagler !

    or does those next fights want count because hes moving up in weight for those fights, but at the same time he is the undisputed mw champ right ? so i think it does count :smooch
     
  14. Sedona

    Sedona Active Member Full Member

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    entirely too early to tell.
    The Hag was otherworldly.
     
  15. jaco

    jaco Thomas Hearns Full Member

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    No, he is simply nowhere near as good as Hagler in any aspect. He's definately a solid fighter, but he has a lot of holes in his game and lacks the intangibles/diversity of an ATG like Hagler. We must remember that he was being outboxed by Jermain Taylor at times during the rematch, I can't possibly see the same happening to the Marvelous one. No I don't hate Pavilk, I enjoy watching him but IMO, he just isn't of the same class.