Is it possible that the Ali of Quarry 2 was the best version ?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by he grant, Jun 28, 2020.


  1. louis54

    louis54 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    One of his best nights..........quarry gave everyone a good fight but Ali destryed him...Ali was on
     
  2. ETM

    ETM I thought I did enough to win. Full Member

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    I have always thought this was Ali's peak at least from the 70s. He was in great shape for Quarry 2. His hands were as quick as ever. Ali had been fighting regularly since losing to Frazier. He had gotten the feel of the ring back. Poor Jerry Quarry had some **** for luck. Ali did respect Quarry as a fighter.
    Ali's legs looked strong but it was a short one sided fight so its impossible to say how much he could have in them with a guy who could apply pressure.

    One thing that doesn't get considered when fans start to discuss Ali being past it. Ali missed 3 and a half years of fighting. He lost $ but that's 3 years of punishment he didnt take. 3 years of wear and tear. Not to mention Ali by most accounts lived a clean life. My point being Ali was a young 29 when he returned. The mileage on his odometer was much less than the average fighter at that age. When he was in top shape 1970-1973 he could come pretty close to that lofty peak.
     
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  3. ETM

    ETM I thought I did enough to win. Full Member

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    Ali also called his 60s competition 'lightwork' compared to later.
     
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  4. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Agreed.
     
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  5. Webbiano

    Webbiano Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    The lay off is an interesting one to ponder. It definitely allowed him to fighter later into old age. Fury, Vitali and Mayweather are good examples are how this has worked effectively for a small minority
     
  6. Charlietf

    Charlietf Well-Known Member booted Full Member

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    It is a myth that 70s Ali was stronger than 67 Ali. Ali at 25 was in his peak. Fast and strong.
    And of course he did hit harder in 1967 because he was faster with his hands too
     
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  7. Charlietf

    Charlietf Well-Known Member booted Full Member

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    Lol
     
  8. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Especially he had higher output and slightly better timing and accuracy. I was going to mention that he had a much higher KO ratio in the 60's, but then you'd get the whole "his 70's comp was much better" thing and another long discussion involving Liston's age etc.

    Better to keep to some specific points:

    1. Every fighter is of course more experienced when they grow older and they are all also bigger in their 30's and probably a bit stronger and has a bit more on their punches, but in every case except a very select few we agree that the late/mid 20's version is better because of superior speed, stamina and reflexes. We also all seem to agree that Ali never had the same speed, stamina and reflexes in the 70's as he had in the 60's.

    2. Everyone agrees that Ali had a style that was built around speed and athleticism. It wasn't built around solid fundamentals like Moore's or Hopkin's. He had a young man's style. So if anything point 1 should apply more to him than to your average fighter, not less.

    And I have never gotten a good explanation as to why point 1 supposedly should apply less to him than to your average fighter. Why should the loss of speed and stamina count less for someone who built his style around those assets?

    This is perhaps the most counter logical argument made frequently on this board and I think that the only reason it's made is to make out that Frazier beat a prime Ali. It is so baseless that I can think of no other reason.
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2020
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  9. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I do agree though that Ali looked very sharp against Quarry in the rematch and that it probably was one of the best versions of him in the 70's.
     
  10. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker Full Member

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    Ali was tired and loosing steam in the first dight after a strong first round and by his own admittance was fortunate that Quarry suffered such a bad cut so early .. these were his own words .. he was no near near as sharp as he was for the second fight.
     
  11. The Long Count

    The Long Count Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I think so. The younger version of Ali was faster, but he wasn’t as filled out or strong- Doug Jones pushed him around, Cooper had him out on his feet at the bell, this version of Ali was strong and fast. Definitely the best version for the 1970s and depending On what you like in a fighter could be the best over all. He lost some speed but he was wiser and stronger and still very fast
     
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  12. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker Full Member

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    Keep in mind that Quarry went on to flatten Shavers dice up Lyle a year after this fight ..
     
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  13. Richmondpete

    Richmondpete Boxing Addict Full Member

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    No. Just a great performance by a still great fighter
     
  14. RulesMakeItInteresting

    RulesMakeItInteresting Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I don't think Foreman would have lasted five rounds with 60s Ali. Too many angles, too much chasing on George's part.

    70s Ali had increased ring IQ (duh) and at times perhaps a heavier right. But watch the Brian London and Cleveland Williams fights...that guy was insanely great.

    But hey, I still count Ali as the Greatest anyway, loved him a lot.
     
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  15. ronnyrains

    ronnyrains Active Member Full Member

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    Ali as I've stated before wanted to set the record three World heavyweight titles, Albeit was four, as far as the WBA was concerned Liston, Terrell, Foreman, and Spinks, WBA took his strap twice, and nearly a third!
     


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