James DeGale and George Groves happened too soon.

Agreed.

So what if you lose? Get back on the horse and go again. That's the problem with keeping fighters apart, a loss is ultimately a disaster because you're fighting someone that shouldn't beat you. Even at world level we see it, with fighters taking several easy defences.

:good

 

dealdealgood:good

 

It came too soon for DeGale.

But for Groves it was a great moral victory and now he is a British Champion with a nice payday.

I dont think Groves would think it would come too soon.

There is a winner and there is a loser - in this whole event - thats what competiton is.

The OP is basically saying - that prospects - should not be in competitive fights so early on.

But whats the alternative - build them up into protected paper champs - to protect the precious 0. -

How boring and non risk taking is that - thats Frank Warrens tried and tested method - and we all know how many false paper champions he creates.

If your for real - than prove it.

If your good enough - your old enough.

DeGale had no real solid reasons why he was such a warm odds on fancy to beat Groves - other than his own

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- which alot of people got suckered into.

Groves got hurt by Anderson - but thats boxing - you go out in the rain you get a little wet - he came through it and became stronger and better and more seasoned for it.

 

Good post, Flint. Even ignoring that you claimed Groves had crumbled by accepting DeGale's bet.

 

Benetiz -World Champion at 17 years old.

Tyson - World Champion at 20 years old - Undisputed / Linear at 22 / 23 years old

If your good enough your old enough.

DeGale just werent good enough - he looked confused and short of ideas - when Groves didnt obilge to stand there like a human punch bag and make him look good.

 

It depends on the fighter when they step up but Groves-Degale is not the same as Sweet Pea-Ramirez or Holyfield-Qawi or even Curry-Starling.

You can't always ask a 12 fight prospect to fight an established world class fighter but you should able to ask him to fight another 12 fight prospect.

 

:good

That's it man.

An "0" is just a marketing tool these days, which is more dangerous to the sport, as it promotes you take on lesser challenges, which obviously drives fans away when their paying for non competitive fights, as they tend to be boring to watch.

The greatest fighters of all time have losses, its not whether you lose, or how you lose, its whether you can come back from a defeat, whether it makes you a better fighter down the road, look at MAB, Holyfield, they get mad respect from me because of the way they came back to reestablish themselves, even Khan to a lesser degree.

I'm not a fan of Khan personally, but if you dont respect the way he came back from his loss, then........

 

I thought he was naive and foolish and let his ego get the better of him for accepting a foolish bet - even though he ended up winning - why jeapordise your whole purse - just becasue some loud mouth challenges you to a ego bet.

But I picked Groves to win the fight - just thought it was going to be a case of substance and grit over flashy style.

 

To me its kind of the bully mentality, when your overconfident, you think your gonna go in there and go crash bang wallop, all over, your not anticipating the guy might withstand, or weather your storm, come back and start asking questions of you, so when they dont cooperate with you, and your not mentally contemplating that, that COULD happen, your not ready to deal with it.

Agree, that's it Gaz, we aren't talking about extremes here, just plausible match ups that can further your career.

 

Good post.

Fans need to be more demanding of fighters, not necessarily abusive, disrespectful, there is too much of that, but more hard to please, after all, fans are paying for the entertainment, its only right fans should set the tone on what they'll accept, same should go for television networks, otherwise your in danger of alienating a fan base, or worse still, alienating the next generation of fans who might turn to other combat sports.

 

Thats what I mean when I say James DeGale has a

Glib Sense of Entitlement.

He thought somehow - that victory and all the glory had to be for him - just because he is special.

In this western world we live - with all the media conditioning , etc - there are alot of people in society - with this Glib Sense of Entitlement.

Its not based on anything in reality or anything they had achieved - just based on their own sense of being special.

Now and again though - they come up against people - who are mentally strong enough - not to yield to this glib sense of entitlement - and refuse to play to the script of rolling over and giving them the treatment they are use to.

Fortunately - George Groves was one of these people.

 

Good post, agree 100%.

It reminds me of some people I know, they come from council estates, yet they act like their upper to middle class, like this and that isn't good enough for them, and I'm like, mofo you come from a COUNCIL ESTATE, where the fuk is your perception? you know what it is though imo, some people delude themselves, they have this perception in their head of the way they see themselves, how others should perceive them, and they truly think its reality, when in fact, the only one that think it, is them, so as you say, when people dont cooperate with them, they get frustrated, mentally they get mind fuked.

 

The fight needed to be made when it was & produced the best possible result

Groves gets a higher profile, stays undefeated & will be on PPV soon fighting for a world title

DeGale gets a wake-up call & realises that his talent alone will not win him every fight

The fight itself was close & competitive for 12 rounds, good for both guys & British boxing in general

And the door is left open for a sequel or two, what more can you ask from a British title fight?

 

People who are use to being centre of attention even media attnetion - use to getting their own way - use to be the one who gets the hottest lady - - and use to people kissing their ass all the time and been told all their life they are special - can easily develop this glib sense of entitlement.

This Glib Sense of entitlement - will influence others - into giving the person the special treatment they command.

But its always fun - when they come across a person who refuse to yield to their script - its a violation of their expectations.

 

Exactly.

People underestimate the value of the British title and it pisses me off.

You can have all the English, EU, EU-EE and that intercontinental bollocks.... but there's nothing like beating the British champion for that belt (or beating the #1 contender to keep it).

There's some cracking matches that could be made for the British title in the next 12 months in most weight classes. It's likely that we'll see Chisora vs Fury, and hopefully we get to see the likes of Quigg vs Frampton plus others.

We are also getting Murray vs Mitchell, which whilst not being for the title, is an important crossroads fight for both.