I'm 50/50 with this fight. If Joe can survive early and not get caught with big shots then I see Joe wearing him down and making him frustrated.
Yes he was ,but he was basically a one armed swarmer,with terrific relentless agression,and stamina,who never beat a top puncher, was manhandled and bounced around by the only one he met and only won 1 out of 5 against ATGs.Disagree?I disagree about Ali being better against Frazier the first time he was clearly in better shape from regular competition the second fight ,and wasnt fighting the no1 man after 18rds of boxing in 31/2 years under his belt,If you think Frazier wasnt a one trick pony show me a fight he won by stanidng off and boxing ,or countering his opponent ,moving in and out,etc ,he fought one way in one gear,ie one trick.Back him up and he was yours,it was quite a feat to do it but ,in their last fight Ali made Joe back off at times .When he met Foreman it was target practice for George,every time he came in George pushed him back so he was on the end of his long swings and roundhouse shots ,and when he did get in George uppercut the **** out of him ,Frazier was F****D,if things didnt go according to plan.
Frazier met one big puncher and was dropped 6 times before it was stopped stylistically Liston is all wrong for Joe imo.
A fighter with the power of Liston could always KO a fighter like Frazier, who had a solid and underrated chin IMO but not a great one. But Liston did also not meet that many punchers, OK, Williams for example, but he has one of the most padded KO- records IMO, his only notable KO- win was over Terrell, and now we´re saying that Liston traded shots with a murderous puncher like Cleveland, etc., but IMO Liston never faced a great puncher in his prime, the same like you correctly wrote about Frazier (until Foreman)...
Its true Williams record is somewhat padded,you could say the same about Earnie Shavers ,but no one disputes he could hit a ton.Williams did manage to beat Holman ,Richardson,Danielsx2,Terrell,Agramonte,Miteff,and Bethea ,all of them were rated at one time or another.Plus a draw with Machen.
Has anyone seen Liston vs. Scrap Iron Johnson? It's on Youtube and the uploaded made a point of how Johnson fought almost EXACTLY like a poor mans Frazier... And he was actually backing Liston up. A lot.
I agree. It might be interesting whilst it lasted but I honestly can't see this going too far. Liston is stylistic hell for Frazier, plus Liston's the more durable fighter and won't have to go looking for him. Liston would feast on Joe moving straight in (he knew nothing else). I just can't see Joe being successful in a to-to-toe slugfest against Liston, as tough as he was he'd eventually be overwhelmed. Liston has all the tools to outbox him too, I just can't see how Frazier beats him. I predict a Foreman type stoppage somehere round the 4th. :good
Who says he's going to be fighting a slugfest? I see Frazier getting Liston against the ropes, digging in, and going to work. Liston, physically, is no Foreman, and won't be pushing him off and around. Even if he WAS that strong, a competent ref wouldn't allow it.
Liston was over 37 when he fought Johnson,probably over 40 if truth be known.Liston had a bigger neck than Foreman ,bigger chest ,bigger biceps ,and hands and longer reach,Foeman was 2 inches taller thats about it.So physically Sonny matches up well with George.
Bottom line - Sonny has the power and force to halt Frazier's relentless forward movement. Few in history have such a luxury. This is bad news for Joe.
Be a good fight that I could see going either way. I initially leaned toward Liston, but Frazier certainly could win. Possible that Liston bombs Frazier out early, however, I doubt it. Liston had a good jab and better overall skills. More power, faster starter, better chin. Having said all that, Frazier had tremendous stamina, good power in his own right, and more heart than any human has a right to have. I see Sonny outboxing Joe early, maybe even dropping him once or twice. But, Joe is too tough and too determined to stay down. He wasn't that much smaller than Liston, and eventually he would start getting inside and landing that left hook. To those who think it would be a replay of Frazier-Foreman, I would argue that Liston, while strong, didn't have quite the same freakish strength as Foreman. And Liston definitely didn't have the speed of Frazier's other conqueror, Ali. I could see Joe gradually wearing down Sonny with a steady diet of hooks to the body. Frazier had underrated movement and would slip a fair number of those long jabs on his way in. And while Liston may have been a good infighter, he wasn't better than Joe. If Sonny can keep from being worn down and stopped late, he might win a close decision, maybe 8 rounds to 7, or 9 to 6. Otherwise, Joe grinds Sonny down and stops him between 13-15. Best guess, I could be wrong, of course. But, that's how I see the fight potentially playing out.