Yes to piggy back off your point Holyfield said Bowe was better than Lewis. Probably because he beat Lewis. He also said Mike Tyson would beat James Toney in their primes. While I agree with this second opinion I think him beating Tyson and losing to Toney may play a factor.
Larry Holmes didnt struggle more in his fight with Norton than Ali did in the 2nd Norton fight. I had the 2nd Ali vs Norton fight a draw. Couldve gone either way. Obviously Ali lost the first and the 3rd on was a straight robbery.
Definitely not.. I had Ali vs Norton 2 a draw. Couldve gone either way. I dont even think Larry needed that last round vs Norton in their fight (which was a toss up) to win
I think he wouldve beaten all of them. I think hed do better than Ali vs Fraizer but not as well as Ali vs Liston and Foreman because of his lack of physical strength which Ali very understatedly had.
Peak Norton struggled with the most faded version of Ali while peak Holmes struggled with the most faded version of Norton.
You think the 1985 version of Holmes who lost to Spinks x2 and barely scrapped by Carl Williams beats that list of fighters ? I have to strongly disagree. Frazier's swarming style would also be a nightmare for Holmes especially 1985 version, who wasn't even confident he could beat the best fighters of his own era at that time. Let alone the likes of Frazier, Foreman.
I agree with you with Holmes Norton (I had it 143-142 Holmes taking the first 7 and then 13). It should be noted though Norton was definitely past his athletic best and overall was slightly past his prime, he started much slower than the Norton of 72-75'.
Norton wasnt faded. He was the number 1 Heavyweight in the world prior to the Holmes fight. And peak Norton was in the 3rd Ali fight and he didnt struggle at all. He just got robbed.
Why are we picking the 1985 Holmes who was 35? I meant at the age Ali was when he faced Fraizer which was 29. And if its about how many fights they were into their career then why not pick Holmes from the Mike Weaver or Earnie Shavers fights?
Ken Norton was 35 years old and lost every subsequent "big" fight after fighting Holmes including getting blasted by Earnie Shavers and Gerry Cooney and struggling against a journeyman like Scott LeDoux. He was definitely in the twilight of his career. As to Ali-Norton lll CBS had a panel which included Joe Frazier score the fight. He had it 8-7 Norton. That's hardly a robbery. Ali was always the more shopworn fighter when he faced Kenny.