And this is probably the single biggest problem people seem to have. Every time they see "banned" they think that poster is never coming back and it has them doing backflips. But if someone posts a picture of a dick in the Lounge, or reveals the true name of a poster who hasn't done so on the forum, or spends a decade complaining about nothing, of course they are going to receive a punishment ban. And that's the second problem. I think a lot of people that complain about this stuff just don't use internet forums - this is it for them, just here. And they don't understand that a punt now and again is absolutely the price of doing business, whether or not you agree with it. And they think they are in some sort of "free space", they don't understand it is no different than a night club, or a museum, or a university, it's a space with owners, share-holders and rules. The sad part is I've been through all this with McVey one on one, and not even that long ago. I took him through every single poster that had received a permanban in a six or seven-week stretch, and why, and it just doesn't go in. I tried to use a pub as an example - that if he was in a pub, he wasn't allowed to do whatever he liked he had to follow certain rules within. He interpreted this as me "telling him to **** off" because i'd said that if you don't like the rules in that pub you might drink in another one. For some reason it was just impossible for him to understand this stuff.