mcvey, This content is protected I proved conclusively that Johnson signed to defend his title against his three most dangerous opponents Langford twice ,Jeannette twice and McVey once.I gave promoters names, dates, locations, and purses.I also gave the reasons why those fights did not happen.Should you wish to debate that make a thread about it. This content is protected This content is protected Let me explain something Johnson's opponents were picked by the White public,if he could have made big money fighting black challengers he would have done so. This content is protected You applaud Carnera for making two gimme defences saying," boxing is a business",then castigate Johnson for fighting Jim Flynn and Co for $30,000 a pop. This content is protected Don't you see the contradiction in your stance? This content is protected I was so concerned about this vote I didn't even participate in it ,so how could I be a loser,sore or otherwise? This content is protected This content is protected ! Your not in control of your thought processes are you. This content is protected
"mcvey,He who laughs last never got the joke in the first place! mcvey, You are not" people", you're a virus.lol This content is protected "mcvey, She was the real version of Nick Latka's Wife in The Harder They Fall. This content is protected I give credit where it is due,but I don't applaud bullsh*t. This content is protected
Primo didn't have much luck with Women. He is ordered by a fascist dictator to keep away from Runyons wife. This no doubt was the start of the Ambling alp, satchel feet jokes in the press..Then on the night after his shellacking from Baer most of his purse is withheld because of the breach of promise charge from the London waitress.
Yes, Carnera was a legitimate champion, who beat some other world class boxers. He wasn't a time great, but he was a champion.
I don't deal in stories, I produce facts that can be verified, facts that prove Johnson signed to fight Langford ,McVey and Jeannette.In response you produced nothing to challenge that, you never do.Just vague accusations. If you want to debate the issue then make a thread on it, I'll gladly produce dates,locations ,and promoters,you will produce nothing. If you don't think the white public wanted Johnson to defend against white challengers so there was a chance a white man might regain the heavyweight title ,then there is no way you can be reached mentally. Why do you think the White Hope Era started in the first place? The three leading promoters Coffroth,Curley ,and Rickard all stated that two black men don't draw flies at the box office. Jeannette and McVey fought 49rounds for a total purse of $6000 shared between them . Your ignorance of this time in boxing history is encapsulated by your remark below "not one of the big three were available on that specific day, please. " Jeannette and Langford certainly weren't ,they were fighting each other the next day! McVey was in Australia preparing for his fight with Colin Bell 8 days later! lol! Oh my word do you mug yourself when you post here!! You couldn't make this sh*t up!
Stop press! You cannot be either a winner or a loser if you didn't take part in it to begin with! I don't hate Carnera ,I disliked Hamed and now do Broner, but Carnera doesn't register with me one way or the other. I do however find it amusing when posters such as Perry say, he was a good guy cut him some slack. Who says he was a good guy? Maybe he was ,maybe he wasn't, but I like proof. Where is the proof he was such a nice fella? Is it on record that he participated in any acts of charity ? Did he donate money or time to deserving causes because I've never heard of any instance of this happening.Lets hear about any of these selfless acts that entitle him to be called," a good guy ." Just a couple of examples from other heavyweight champions donating either time or money or both to help others. Joe Louis donated his entire sparring money proceeds from his training camp for the Carnera fight to a fund for Sam Langford.Langford himself gave shed loads of his dough away to down and out boxers. Even Ray Robinson ,[ and none bargained harder for their purse,] donated the purses of a couple of fights to cancer relief Louis twice defended his title for training expenses, his purses going to the Army and Navy relief Funds.Ali gave away untold $$$$ Gene Tunney contributed money towards Langford's living expenses in his last years. Jack Dempsey and Jesse Owens gave their time and $ to a charity baseball game for Langford. Jack Johnson paid for Sam McVey's funeral,Max Schmeling contributed to the cost of Joe Louis funeral. What acts of selflessness/charity did Carnera engage in? I'd really like to know how he came by this reputation as a good guy!
Johnson did sign to fight Sam Langford as champion in 1909. He pulled out! Yes, many folks, some black and most white wanted Johnson to lose. Jack Johnson avoided the best white challengers in GunBoat Smith ( who TKO'd him in an exhibition match ), and possibly Luther McCarty, and avoided the best black challengers in Langford, Jeannette, and McVey. History shows us this. The best he fought as champion was Willard, who knocked him out. As for your comment " The three leading promoters Coffroth,Curley ,and Rickard all stated that two black men don't draw flies at the box office. " BS! First off Johnson as champion fought black Journeyman Jim Battling Johnson in 1913, and drew! So you see Johnson would fight a lesser accomplished black fighter. Secondly, many of the promoters advertised large purses on an all African Amercian title match with Johnson to the tune of $50,000.00. If the promoters really felt that way, that they " would not draw flies ", they would have gone to the lengths they did to get Langford, Jeannette, or Mcvey in the ring with Johnson.
I could bring up some examples. But the manner in which you asked is loaded. And you already seem inclined to disagree that he did good things. So the idea of putting out examples leaves one open to chastisement from AngryBoxingFan#1 And that discourages sharing of information.
No, he had signed to fight Langford in1908 just prior to challenging Burns for the title. His purse was to have been $6000 the fight to be held at the NSC Covent Garden.Johnson had had to take the short end of the purse to get Burns into the ring.Burns got a record $30,000 ,Johnson $5000, Now as champion he demanded the same purse money as Burns had received against him. Johnson offered to defend against Luther McCarty in Canada Tommy Burns who was promoting both McCarty and Arthur Pelkey refused to make the fight ,he wanted McCarty v Pelkey instead which he subsequently did promote.In reply to the exiled Johnson's telegram Burns told the press I will not promote a Johnson fight, it is not in the best interests of boxing,what he meant was it was not in the best interests of Tommy Burns. I'm not going to dignify the silly tko sparring story with yet another rebuttal, you will keep repeating it , its fine, nobody takes any notice. Johnson twice subsequently agreed to defend against Langford and should you wish to debate this, all you need to do is make a thread about it and I will gladly furnish you with dates purses and the forfeit money required to make the fights materialise I will also demonstrate why the fights did not happen.That will be infinitely better than hijacking this thread further which is about another subject entirely. So make a thread about Johnson avoiding these top black challengers and ,while you are at it, make sure you produce primary sourced reports stating who was prepared to promote these fights, where and for what amount? Now your bluff has been called and the ball is squarely in your court! Put up or shut up!
I will accept with good grace any verified examples you provide. Carnera may have been a real nice guy he may have a bit of a sh*t or he may have been somewhere in between. Any information that has a verified provenance can only add to our appreciation of him one way or the other. So lets have your examples,if they exist.
mcvey, Stop press! You cannot be either a winner or a loser if you didn't take part in it to begin with! This content is protected I don't hate Carnera ,I disliked Hamed and now do Broner, but Carnera doesn't register with me one way or the other. This content is protected I do however find it amusing when posters such as Perry say, he was a good guy cut him some slack. Who says he was a good guy? Maybe he was ,maybe he wasn't, but I like proof. This content is protected Where is the proof he was such a nice fella? Is it on record that he participated in any acts of charity ? Did he donate money or time to deserving causes because I've never heard of any instance of this happening.Lets hear about any of these selfless acts that entitle him to be called," a good guy ." Just a couple of examples from other heavyweight champions donating either time or money or both to help others. Joe Louis donated his entire sparring money proceeds from his training camp for the Carnera fight to a fund for Sam Langford.Langford himself gave shed loads of his dough away to down and out boxers. Even Ray Robinson ,[ and none bargained harder for their purse,] donated the purses of a couple of fights to cancer relief Louis twice defended his title for training expenses, his purses going to the Army and Navy relief Funds.Ali gave away untold $$$$ This content is protected Gene Tunney contributed money towards Langford's living expenses in his last years. Jack Dempsey and Jesse Owens gave their time and $ to a charity baseball game for Langford. Jack Johnson paid for Sam McVey's funeral,Max Schmeling contributed to the cost of Joe Louis funeral. What acts of selflessness/charity did Carnera engage in? I'd really like to know how he came by this reputation as a good guy! This content is protected
I made truthful posts about Carnera .I'm not responsible how a minority interpreted them and I really don't care. It doesn't affect how his boxing career is viewed but it affects how he should be perceived as a man,and it wasn't me that brought up the issue of his character as mitigation for his lack of ability. So actually nothing of any interest or relevance from you on this whatsoever. Do you live in fear of missing one of my posts without commenting adversely on it?
I satisfied myself that Carnera KOd Sharkey legitimately a long time ago, but let’s say that I was wrong. You would still be left with a whole myriad of wins over world class fighters to explain away (see Carnera vs. the contenders thread). Even if you assumed that the Sharkey fight was a dive, and that perhaps a couple more key fights were, you would still be left with one of the better contenders of the era, and that is before you even got into the footage.