Liston vs Wlad Klitschko

Uhmmm... I was replying to the earlier statements about how Liston's reach would be an advantage for him.

In reality, we all know that Wlad is a bigger, faster, stronger, and more talented boxer than Liston ever was. Hell, he even has much better footwork/movement. I don't care how many documentaries you watch... or how many times you use "**** & ****" on internet message boards to sound like a hard ass. The bias around the boxing message boards toward the older, undersized, heavyweights of the past is pathetic. As if every sport in the world has advanced 10 fold, and all athletes/fighters in every other sport have got so much better.... but yet boxers have got worse. This is why boxing is where it is... most of it's "fans" (like yourself) are mind-numbingly stupid.

If you haven't noticed, I always stay out of threads like this. For a few reasons.

1. They are pointless, useless threads. The reason why the classic forum sucks now compared to what it was years ago.

2. Out of respect for fighters of the past. They were great in their own eras, and they should be judged in their own era.

3. Posters like Hendo and yourself.

 

:good on all counts.

 

Clearly, I favor Liston but I take issue with this.

Chris Byrd made every fighter he ever fought miss frequenlty and look bad including Vitali and Ike ..except Wlad. Even by the time of the rematch, he was a difficult target. Wlad found him with crisp jabs and right hands all night in both fights.

 

I don't agree with any of that, apart from Wladimir being bigger.
Faster and stronger ? There's nothing in it. Both were a bit ponderous, but both could display very good punch speed at times.
"More talented boxer", I'm not even sure how that's measured or judged.
Liston was easily as nimble on his feet as Wlad is, actually he moved far more than Wlad, but neither of them are amazing in that area.

Both of them are formidable fighters. I think Liston was better in that he showed more variety and was more aggressive, but I cannot underestimate Wlad's methodical style - Wlad looks a bit too predictable and one-dimensional but he gets the job done.

I think Liston wins but he wasn't reliable enough for me to have much certainty there.

 

Why wouldn't he, it was target practice. Chris Byrd had a 74" reach and no power. It's easy for Wlad to fight a man with a much shorter reach and nothing to keep him off. Liston's reach matches Wlad's .. his jab would bust Wlad up. Wlad cuts and bruises up easily .. completely different fight. As far as making miss goes, Ike took Byrd's head off in four rounds, something neither K Brother was able to do, so he did no miss that much ...

 

Maricano makes love to your mother in hell.

 

Good points.
It does bother me when I consider Wladimir's resume and conclude that Byrd and Chambers are among his best 3 or 4 wins, and those guys were seriously lacking in firepower and raw strength, and were only mediocre in pure boxing skill.

 

-Only good points if someone drew an analogy to Byrd and Liston, which I most certainly did not. I just take issue with Byrd being lumped in there as a stiff that let Wlad beat on him.

-Call it what you, Byrd was a frustrating opponent to hit cleanly regardless of his size. Really haven't seen too many fighter at heavyweight do the things he did in terms of staying in range and making fighter's miss so often. He was a very unorthodox spoiler in that regard. But yeah, very little power outside of shaking Tua up.

-As for Chambers, clearly more skillful than Povetkin, Peter, and Dimitrenko. Conditioning was his problem and he corrected it, but his trap setting and counter punching approach was simply all wrong for Wlad. I like Chambers quite a bit, very fun guy to watch. Little power, but his punches are fantastic looking..busted up Peter and Povetkin pretty good, put Dimitrenko down several times.


**** it, I'm sure this will be misquoted by somebody.."Uh, Liston is no Eddie Chambers. Liston will beat Wlad" when that clearly isn't what I was saying. I'm done with this forum, too much negativity and stupidity, it just isn't funny anymore..long live Bert Cooper! I'm retired.

 

Fres Oquendo and Andrew Golota landed plenty on Byrd, and many spectators thought they beat him. His slickness must be overrated.
Yes, Wlad is a sharp puncher, he times his jabs well and finds the target.

Yes, I think Chambers is pretty good too.
He should correct his conditioning some more and get down around 190 pounds where he could live up to the "Fast Eddie" nickname.

 

Liston all day long, hes got the stronger, better jab, the better chin and he hits harder. Hes willing to take what Wlad would throw, but could Wlad take what Liston throws?

People who keep sucking the Klits dicks just because they happen to be bigger
If Klits are so good beacuse theyre so big? then what are Dempsey, Maricano, Frazier, Tyson?

 

Are you being serious? Wlad is known for his great handspeed. He is definitely faster than Liston, and it isn't even close. Also.... Wlad moves MUCH better and much more than Liston on his feet. I can't even believe that is in question.

You don't know how boxing talent is measured or judged? Really?

Wlad is never one dimensional.... he has a GREAT jab, a GREAT straight right, and a GREAT left hook. He also completely controls the timing, space, and distance of his fights (usually through his great jab and footwork). He always keeps his opponents off balance. He also leads with the left hook, hooks off the jab, bring the right overtop, and also has shown his uppercut/body punching when needed. The point is that he normally doesn't need to come out of his gameplan and open up more than what's neccessary. He completely dominates the other best fighters in the world and stops them. When he does decide to open up, it's a brilliant display. BTW, Wlad always fights best against aggressive fighters. The fights that people think Wlad was boring in, are the fights where his opponents lost their heart and just play defense all night long.

So, we have established that Wlad has a great left hand, a great right hand... great footwork, ring generalship, defense.... unless you want him to hit his opponents with his dick, I really don't know what else he needs to do.

 

Only you haters keep coming out with this "People only say Klits win because they're big" nonsense. I don't see anyone saying that Wlad wins just because he's big. Of course his size advantage is a big plus... when it is combined with his strength, speed, power, and boxing ability.