Mikkel Kessler: What makes him so good?

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If we throw accomplishments out the window...then essentially you can make an arguement for a fighter who is 1-0-0 with 1 KO as the greatest fighter of all time.

Accomplishments are how you differentiate the good from the great.

 

P4P lists are mostly weak. But some do carry an air of legitimacy. The criteria Amsrerdam uses, and whch I've seen you buy into is WAAY more fallable then what Ring might use. If I am wrong about you buying into it, I apologize.

Then, aside from skill, what do you use to rank Kessler so highly, if not his accomplishments? Wasn't it his accomplishments @ 168 that gave him the across the board ranking of #2 behind Joe? Surely skill alone is a weak standard to use. Skill not put to use is a waste. And the most skillful isn't always the winner.

 

Julio Ceasar Chavez Jr. is al ATG with the criteria they use. I undertand not wanting to use an outdated P4P method, but making one up that's very fallable and doesn't take accomplishemments into consideration doesn't make it any better. It's actually worse.


It's like Amsterdam said in one thread, and i HOPE in jest, Christian Mijares @ CW would beat Haye. Well, Mijares would not be CLOSE to who he is if he weighed 195 pounds.

 

I agree, he is going to embarass Miranda...tho I think its the perfect rebound fight for him after the Calzaghe loss.

As for who can beat him....I may be of the minority...but I consider Bute the class of that weight (or soon to be class of that weight).

 

Bute is good, but not great.

 

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sues and Lance, I don't want this to become a battle of semantics and oversimplifications, so let me clarify something. When I say I don't care about accomplishment, I mean I place no value on "name power". That is, Taylor didn't become great by beating an old and gunshy Hopkins because it was an old and gunshy Hopkins. Obviously, as I actually stated before but you guys ignored or missed it, the caliber of opponent is quite useful in gauging someone's ability. However, CALIBER and NAME do not automatically have anything to do with each other, and often times are diametrically opposed!

By "name" standards, Taylor has a far better resume than Kessler. By "caliber" standards, Kessler's is better. Not only that, Taylor has lost plenty of rounds against not only the people he was fed coming up, but at the "elite" level since becoming a tv commodity. Kessler won about 99% of the rounds in his career and 33% against a very good version of Calzaghe (I disagree with Amsterdam about him being half-shot...he has made up for his somewhat diminished handspeed with even better instincts, patience and accuracy).

 

ANd JCC jr has won more rounds aginast his comp then Taylor has as well. Probaby more then Tito too.

But I'm not talking about just being a NAME FIGHTER. That just means more people know who you are IMHO, doesn't make you better. But all those I have mentioned HAVE done more then Kessler has. That's not arguable. It's expected you will lose more rounds then normal when you step up in comp. That's precisley what Kessler did.

And Rahman may not be as skilled as Kessler, but he beat his HW Champ who was highly favored. Can't say the same for kessler.

 

JCC Jr. has struggled against crap opposition, I'm not sure this is the best example. I mean struggled against D levels mate.

Kessler has dominated everything but A's.

 

:huh

He's put **** performances against D's, we judge on performances and how GOOD they are by watching them, JCC Jr. is not even impressive. You can tell how good someone is against lower calibre opposition, take Gamboa for example, it's too early to say he's going to be a definite P4P, but it's not too early to say he's an incredible talent with only minor flaws just from watching him.

JCC Jr. has virtually nothing resembling top level skill and has actually struggled like crazy against worse opp. than Gamboa has annihilated.

You need a better example if we're going to discuss the P4P criteria...

Oh come on man...

That was evidently a stupid joke, I hope you're sharper than that.

 

Kessler is good, I give him a solid B rating. He is really effective with the things he does well like jab straight right.

 

And your favourite fighter, Mundine, is a good win for anybody. Wouldn't you say he's superior or on par with Taylor and Pavlik?

 

No....no I wouldnt.

 

Nice to see Chico back