Should he get over it? I agree he should. Was it the same thing he did to all of his opponents? **** no. Calling Chuvalo, for instance, an old washerwoman and calling Frazier an Uncle Tom are completely different. They're not similar at all. His taunting went beyond the playful by leaps and bounds with Frazier, mate. I don't really know how you can make that statement unless you don't understand the ramifications or social meaning of some of Ali's taunts.[/QUOTE] How about calling Ernie Terrell an uncle tom? Terrell isn't really bitter today about that. besides, Frazier calls Ali CLAY all the time. Ali isn't really bitter towards Frazier anymore.
It is much easier looking from the outside saying that Frazier should get over it, but put yourself in his shoes. You help Ali get back into boxing, then once he is allowed to fight again he starts calling you an uncle tom (huge insult to a black man) and taunts you to the point where your kids are being tormented in school. That would take its toll on a man. Honestly I think Frazier is more pissed that he was nothing but good to Ali during his exile, but once Ali returned he didn't acknowledge Frazier's help at all and instead torments him the most and with the most hurtful things that he did to anyone in his whole career.
Ali hated what Joe represented in his absence. He was taking what he thought was rightfully still his throne. He clearly took it to another level, and the mere fact Frazier couldn't take it riled Ali to be more joyful and playful about all the taunts, even if cruel. Especially for the Thrilla fight "COME On Gorilla... we in Manilla!" I've seen tons of documentaries and read Ali's autobiographies and biographies but should read Ghosts of Manilla. I think Ali might've hate a severe dislike if not disdain for Frazier around 1970-1971 when the fight was taking underway. Afterwards, he was upset he lost to Frazier and thought he won. Frazier being the first man to beat him didn't help with the taunts of "Ugly" and "Gorilla." Ali didn't attack his looks until after FOTC. He did attack Frazier's intelligence. Eventually, though I don't think Ali hated Frazier. Frazier always ended up hating Ali once promotion for FOTC took place.
Frazier should let it go. It was an act and helped turn their matches into more that the average superbout. What I found more interesting about the document was the fact that Ali wanted to quit after the 14th. If Frazier's camp did not throw in the towel, Frazier would have regained the title. I also wonder about his lack of vision in his left eye. Is that the reason Foreman was able to knock him out?
No.Frazier and Gypsey Joe Harris turned up at Ali's house.Ali was at the door and next to him was a muslim with a gun in his waistband. The full story is in the book Ghosts of Manila.Read it and you'll see why Joe hates Ali,and for good reason.
I dont blame him,he helps Ali when he was down and out Money ect the the piece a **** thanks him by calling him a Uncle Tom,Gorilla ect Ali was a scum bag of a person seperate his boxing ability from the person Ali is a true low life of a person.
Wow Wow Wow Hang on a minute here. I hate all this talk about Ali being a complete scumbag or a complete saint. The truth is he is neither. You gotta take stuff in perspective. Sure he was a **** to Frazier, but think of all the good things he has done and how nicely he has treated other people?
The thousands of fans that he took time out to speak to, made himself available to and treated as fans rather than a nuisance. The people the 'Muhammed Ali centre' has benefitted etc...
To make things clear - I started this thread mostly as a joke. I forgot to put :rofl under the quote from Frazier's phone. It's fixed now. By no means I try to discredit Joe. He let Ali to get into his head and it was kinda immature on his side I guess but... There is a **** load of truth in what this guy wrote. A **** load. I would only add that I think that Ali really was an exceptionally gifted human being, there was some kind of genius in him initially. But he early got things wrong in his head sadly and it got to him big time finally. His life has become, sad to say, in the first place running after fame. That's how I see it. There are many times that he was just plain pathetic and pathetic was the media blind following.
No it would be something like this; While you're suckling yer mummies tit i'll be sucking & biting the other one