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My Pound-For-Pound Top Ten (1st August 2010)

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by horst, Aug 1, 2010.

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oli Boxing Junkie banned

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Dawson at 3??, and Ward ahead of Paul williams?? You cannot be serious. Your list is stupid and im being kind

oli, Aug 1, 2010

#16

Lenin Cat Member Full Member

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Why Cotto has to earn his way back and Marquez doesn't? Cotto's losses could be defended too, Margo didn't fit his style and also suspicions about cheating and the other loss is to p4p number 1 or two at worst. I think Cotto clearly has p4p resume: Malignagi, Quintana, Judah, Clottey, Mosley, Alfonso Gomes. It's not just your list, I rarely see Cotto on any p4p list and I wonder why.

Lenin Cat, Aug 1, 2010

#17

HENDO Boxing Junkie Full Member

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Vitali would beat the **** outta Wlad.

HENDO, Aug 1, 2010

#18
Ponysmallhorse Small but proud Full Member

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HENDO said: ↑

Vitali would beat the **** outta Wlad.
Click to expand...

Kill yourself.

Ponysmallhorse, Aug 1, 2010

#19

HENDO Boxing Junkie Full Member

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Ponysmallhorse said: ↑

Kill yourself.
Click to expand...

And you think otherwise?

Vitali has proven it against better fighters. I guess I can't give him a pass on the Byrd fight, but for the most part he don't fold like a ***** like Wlad does.

Vitali would deliver that pressure, he has the skills, and he can actually take a punch.

Even in his old ass today, he would give Wlad a beating.

HENDO, Aug 1, 2010

#20
PIPO23 Loyal Member banned Full Member

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Donaire should be down a few slots Montiel should be there ahead of Donaire. Chad should drop a few places. Andre WARD..don't know why he's on there?IJuan Ma Lopes is more deserving of that position.

PIPO23, Aug 1, 2010

#21
johnnykoolkid Well-Known Member Full Member

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Glass Jaw Guru said: ↑

where is SNV?
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i was about to ask the same question

johnnykoolkid, Aug 1, 2010

#22

Wiirdo Boxing Addict banned

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Popkins said: ↑

I suggest you track down Darchinyan's last 2 fights.
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Eric Barcelona had never been stopped in 18 losses and has a granite chin. Vic still knocked him down 3 times.

Guerrero ate Darch's powershots like Pez and kept coming. He was widely praised on here for taking an inhuman amount of punishment.

Wiirdo, Aug 1, 2010

#23
anarci Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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M.I.G. said: ↑

Dawson at 3?
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I think Dawson is very good but not deserving of number 3. I would put Martinez over him and Williams is right there too. I still think Marquez should hold the 3 spot until he loses(possibility or one of those other guys gets another big win.

anarci, Aug 1, 2010

#24
RealBoxing Kill The Nonsense Full Member

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1) Mayweather Jr.
2) Pac **
3) Martinez
4) Dawson
5) Marquez
6) Mosley
7) P.Will
8) Hopkins
9) Montiel
10) Ward

Wonjongkam, Bradley, R.Marquez, Alexander,Gamboa,Juanma Lopez

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RealBoxing, Aug 1, 2010

#25
Marcelo Guest

MIne!!

1. Pac
2. PBF
3. JMM
4. Donaire
5. Martinez
6. Cotto
7. Mosley
8. JUanma
9. Pwill
10. Montiel

11. Caballero
12. Ward
13. Dawson
14. Rafa
15. Bhop

Marcelo, Aug 2, 2010

#26

C HOP The World Awaits Full Member

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Hopkins would be no way near my top 10

C HOP, Aug 2, 2010

#27
anarci Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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C HOP said: ↑

Hopkins would be no way near my top 10
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I guess you cant live off the pavlik win for long, especially after Pavlik was schooled by the smaller Martinez. I had Hopkins lower top 10 a couple of months ago but i thhink id take him off now, he isnt gonna do nothing. IMO there are really no marquee fights for him that he can win, he should call it a day, even though he can still whup the contenders i dont see him doing well against Dawson. He should go out a winner.

anarci, Aug 2, 2010

#28
spud1 HAWK TIME!!!! Full Member

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Popkins said: ↑

1.
This content is protected

Why?
He is the man in possession, the king on the throne. As the second-placed fighter is in the same division as the kingpin, the only way he can take this crown is in the ring, and to do that Floyd will have to actually man up, so Pac is safe at number 1 for the foreseeable future. Manny has barely lost a round over the last two years, and is now dominating and decimating men far naturally larger than himself - the definition of a pound-for-pound legend.

2.
This content is protected

Why?
The only choice for number 2, Floyd joins Pacquiao in a league of two far above the best of the rest. Mayweather beat the far smaller Marquez with ease in a routine (and some would argue pointless and unfair) tune-up, but in his next fight he produced the goods big-time vs Mosley. Shook to his boots twice early on, Floyd showed his pound-for-pound star quality by winning every round thereafter. The pressure is now on for him to step up and try to reclaim his former position as number 1. The world continues to wait.

3.
This content is protected

Why?
I realize this may be an unexpected and unpopular choice, but I think Dawson's accomplishments are underrated on the whole. To have beaten Tomasz Adamek as well as Glen Johnson twice, whilst establishing himself as the clear number 1 in the light-heavyweight division, is no mean feat for a young fighter - and anyone doubting the value of the Johnson wins need only see how Johnson turned away top 10 ranked Yusaf Mack in his most recent fight. Dawson has been at the top of his division for a few years now, has beaten the best of the generation before him, and is now taking on the toughest opponent available in Jean Pascal.

4.
This content is protected

Why?
As many on ESB know, I am no fan of Wladimir, not by a long shot. However, even though I find him the most boring boxer of all-time, this does not blind me to his merits. I find it very strange that The Ring continues to ignore someone as dominant as he is. Wladimir is on a long unbeaten streak of dominant victories, and although the standard of opposition has not been great, it is not possible to fight consistently strong comp in a division as weak as heavyweight (especially when a good fighter like Povetkin inexplicably and in my opinion unforgivably shirks out of mandatory challenger status). I do not like Wlad as a boxer, and I do not like the heavyweight division, but a champion this dominant cannot be overlooked when it comes to pound-for-pound standings.

5.
This content is protected

Why?
Martinez is a strange one in terms of pound-for-pound recognition. It wasn't long ago that he was fighting dire competition in small hall fights, and was a million miles away from mixing in this sort of company, but (depending on your personal perspective on the outcomes of some of his recent fights) his last three performances were pretty special. For me he clearly deserved a win vs Cintron, and I scored the Martinez-Williams fight to Maravila. A win over Williams is significant, as the Punisher is himself a legitimate pound-for-pound contender. The major scalp on his record is Kelly Pavlik though, what a win. Martinez, a natural lightmiddle weighing 167lbs on the night, vs Pavlik, middleweight KO specialist who was 178 in the ring, and Martinez turned in a supreme display to thoroughly deserve the verdict - and in my opinion to thoroughly deserve the #5 spot.

6.
This content is protected

Why?
This is another choice which I'm sure many people will disagree with, but pound-for-pound talents are extremely rare in this era, there really aren't many strong candidates, and I think the Super Six leader and favourite deserves some recognition at this point. Although I personally prefer Andre Dirrell as a fighter, Ward is the one who is looking more complete and confident at this stage. To win every minute of every round in a high stakes fight vs Green was superb, and Ward almost shut out Edison Miranda as well. Of course, his greatest win was Kessler, making a mockery of his own inexperience to completely dominate a proven world-class supermiddleweight who went on to take Froch's zero in his next fight. Right now, Ward is looking every bit the next Bernard Hopkins, a long-standing star in the making and a fighter of extreme quality.

7.
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Why?
The Mayweather fight did not affect JMM's pound-for-pound standing one iota in my eyes. Marquez was only up at that weight for the payday, and the size differences rendered it a mismatch. However, I think both Diaz fights have shown that Marquez is patently not the fighter he once was. In 2008, JMM showed in the Pacquiao rematch that he was one of the top two active fighters in the world, but since moving above 130lbs I don't think he looks the same. Marquez's frame and body type clearly don't allow him to carry additional weight well - as proven by his bloated, overweight appearance in the Mayweather clash. In the first Diaz fight, Marquez really struggled with the Baby Bull's pace, aggression and strength early on before his own power, skill and accuracy won out. In the rematch, Marquez was again the better man, but it wasn't a dominant or spectacular or even particularly impressive performance - and a pound-for-pound top 3 or 4 guy would annihilate a Juan Diaz-calibre fighter IMO.

8.
This content is protected

Why?
Many people will feel Williams should be above Ward, as Williams has been around longer and has a higher number of good wins on his ledger, but for me Williams has slid a little in the pound-for-pound stakes because of the nature of his recent fights. The Cintron fight had no resolution so no credit can be given to either man for the outcome, and I felt Martinez beat Williams. Winky Wright is well past his best and was coming off a very long lay-off, and Verno Phillips is even older than Winky! I do rate the win over Phillips, but if you are looking for the last time Williams was a convincing winner over a prime top 10 ranked opponent you'd have to go back to the Quintana rematch in '08. I think Williams has the potential to climb back up the rankings, but in all fairness he is in dire need of a big win, and soon.

9.
This content is protected

Why?
I think Donaire is a great fighter, but I do think The Ring have given him an unjustifiably high placing in their top 10. Yes, he pulled off a sensational knockout of Vic Darchinyan... but that was three years ago now. Since then he has beaten a sequence of good, solid comp, but there's no real solid gold wins there. Donaire will occupy a higher placing in these rankings - but he should do so after he has unified titles or beaten another top name, not in anticipation of this.

10.
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Why?
I'm not a great believer in Calderon, but the dearth of valid contenders for the pound-for-pound top 10 sees him make the cut on the basis of his unbeaten record and longevity. I haven't been all that impressed with his last few performances on the whole, I think he is on the decline, and I don't think his resume is great, irrespective of the quality of the divisions he has fought in. However, in this era you can't knock a guy who has remained unbeaten as long as he has, he has shown himself to be a skilled boxer over the years.

The next in line...

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(very underrated fighter in impressive form over last couple of years)

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(still has enough prestige from the Vasquez four-fight spectacular to jump right back up to elite level with a win over a Juanma Lopez or one of the other top young feathers)

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(has the ability, needs to fight consistently better comp, the Kameda win is not enough in itself)

Not there yet but could be soon with more wins vs top class comp...

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Will have to earn their way back in...

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this is your first decent post since you done the top 50 fights of the last decade article, chad dawon possible star in the making but he has noit done more then wladmir klitscho at this moment and cant deny his quality .

and why sergio martinez, surely tim bradley should be in their as he has beaten better opposition, he has not hd any good wins against decent oppostion apart from kelly pavlik.

spud1, Aug 2, 2010

#29
Boxed Ears this my daddy's account (RIP daddy) Full Member

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Popkins said: ↑

1.
This content is protected

Why?
He is the man in possession, the king on the throne. As the second-placed fighter is in the same division as the kingpin, the only way he can take this crown is in the ring, and to do that Floyd will have to actually man up, so Pac is safe at number 1 for the foreseeable future. Manny has barely lost a round over the last two years, and is now dominating and decimating men far naturally larger than himself - the definition of a pound-for-pound legend.

2.
This content is protected

Why?
The only choice for number 2, Floyd joins Pacquiao in a league of two far above the best of the rest. Mayweather beat the far smaller Marquez with ease in a routine (and some would argue pointless and unfair) tune-up, but in his next fight he produced the goods big-time vs Mosley. Shook to his boots twice early on, Floyd showed his pound-for-pound star quality by winning every round thereafter. The pressure is now on for him to step up and try to reclaim his former position as number 1. The world continues to wait.

3.
This content is protected

Why?
I realize this may be an unexpected and unpopular choice, but I think Dawson's accomplishments are underrated on the whole. To have beaten Tomasz Adamek as well as Glen Johnson twice, whilst establishing himself as the clear number 1 in the light-heavyweight division, is no mean feat for a young fighter - and anyone doubting the value of the Johnson wins need only see how Johnson turned away top 10 ranked Yusaf Mack in his most recent fight. Dawson has been at the top of his division for a few years now, has beaten the best of the generation before him, and is now taking on the toughest opponent available in Jean Pascal.

4.
This content is protected

Why?
As many on ESB know, I am no fan of Wladimir, not by a long shot. However, even though I find him the most boring boxer of all-time, this does not blind me to his merits. I find it very strange that The Ring continues to ignore someone as dominant as he is. Wladimir is on a long unbeaten streak of dominant victories, and although the standard of opposition has not been great, it is not possible to fight consistently strong comp in a division as weak as heavyweight (especially when a good fighter like Povetkin inexplicably and in my opinion unforgivably shirks out of mandatory challenger status). I do not like Wlad as a boxer, and I do not like the heavyweight division, but a champion this dominant cannot be overlooked when it comes to pound-for-pound standings.

5.
This content is protected

Why?
Martinez is a strange one in terms of pound-for-pound recognition. It wasn't long ago that he was fighting dire competition in small hall fights, and was a million miles away from mixing in this sort of company, but (depending on your personal perspective on the outcomes of some of his recent fights) his last three performances were pretty special. For me he clearly deserved a win vs Cintron, and I scored the Martinez-Williams fight to Maravila. A win over Williams is significant, as the Punisher is himself a legitimate pound-for-pound contender. The major scalp on his record is Kelly Pavlik though, what a win. Martinez, a natural lightmiddle weighing 167lbs on the night, vs Pavlik, middleweight KO specialist who was 178 in the ring, and Martinez turned in a supreme display to thoroughly deserve the verdict - and in my opinion to thoroughly deserve the #5 spot.

6.
This content is protected

Why?
This is another choice which I'm sure many people will disagree with, but pound-for-pound talents are extremely rare in this era, there really aren't many strong candidates, and I think the Super Six leader and favourite deserves some recognition at this point. Although I personally prefer Andre Dirrell as a fighter, Ward is the one who is looking more complete and confident at this stage. To win every minute of every round in a high stakes fight vs Green was superb, and Ward almost shut out Edison Miranda as well. Of course, his greatest win was Kessler, making a mockery of his own inexperience to completely dominate a proven world-class supermiddleweight who went on to take Froch's zero in his next fight. Right now, Ward is looking every bit the next Bernard Hopkins, a long-standing star in the making and a fighter of extreme quality.

7.
This content is protected

Why?
The Mayweather fight did not affect JMM's pound-for-pound standing one iota in my eyes. Marquez was only up at that weight for the payday, and the size differences rendered it a mismatch. However, I think both Diaz fights have shown that Marquez is patently not the fighter he once was. In 2008, JMM showed in the Pacquiao rematch that he was one of the top two active fighters in the world, but since moving above 130lbs I don't think he looks the same. Marquez's frame and body type clearly don't allow him to carry additional weight well - as proven by his bloated, overweight appearance in the Mayweather clash. In the first Diaz fight, Marquez really struggled with the Baby Bull's pace, aggression and strength early on before his own power, skill and accuracy won out. In the rematch, Marquez was again the better man, but it wasn't a dominant or spectacular or even particularly impressive performance - and a pound-for-pound top 3 or 4 guy would annihilate a Juan Diaz-calibre fighter IMO.

8.
This content is protected

Why?
Many people will feel Williams should be above Ward, as Williams has been around longer and has a higher number of good wins on his ledger, but for me Williams has slid a little in the pound-for-pound stakes because of the nature of his recent fights. The Cintron fight had no resolution so no credit can be given to either man for the outcome, and I felt Martinez beat Williams. Winky Wright is well past his best and was coming off a very long lay-off, and Verno Phillips is even older than Winky! I do rate the win over Phillips, but if you are looking for the last time Williams was a convincing winner over a prime top 10 ranked opponent you'd have to go back to the Quintana rematch in '08. I think Williams has the potential to climb back up the rankings, but in all fairness he is in dire need of a big win, and soon.

9.
This content is protected

Why?
I think Donaire is a great fighter, but I do think The Ring have given him an unjustifiably high placing in their top 10. Yes, he pulled off a sensational knockout of Vic Darchinyan... but that was three years ago now. Since then he has beaten a sequence of good, solid comp, but there's no real solid gold wins there. Donaire will occupy a higher placing in these rankings - but he should do so after he has unified titles or beaten another top name, not in anticipation of this.

10.
This content is protected

Why?
I'm not a great believer in Calderon, but the dearth of valid contenders for the pound-for-pound top 10 sees him make the cut on the basis of his unbeaten record and longevity. I haven't been all that impressed with his last few performances on the whole, I think he is on the decline, and I don't think his resume is great, irrespective of the quality of the divisions he has fought in. However, in this era you can't knock a guy who has remained unbeaten as long as he has, he has shown himself to be a skilled boxer over the years.

The next in line...

This content is protected
(very underrated fighter in impressive form over last couple of years)

This content is protected
(still has enough prestige from the Vasquez four-fight spectacular to jump right back up to elite level with a win over a Juanma Lopez or one of the other top young feathers)

This content is protected
(has the ability, needs to fight consistently better comp, the Kameda win is not enough in itself)

Not there yet but could be soon with more wins vs top class comp...

This content is protected

Will have to earn their way back in...

This content is protected

Click to expand...

Respectable, logic you can actually follow, a little more synced up with me than the Ring's list. Good job, Pop.

Boxed Ears, Aug 2, 2010

#30

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