OK, what am I missing about Ron Lyle?

I can’t wait for Arum to finally give us Forum Lyle vs Forum Tua now that the fight has marinated a few years.

 

Very little to be honest.

The point should be made that he got into boxing at an advanced age, and might have been truly terrifying if brought along right.

He has the George Godfrey/Cleveland Williams factor.

By that I mean that his paper record doesn't look all that, but the gym rats thought that he was teh most terrifying fighter in the world.

When you factor in his losing effort with Foreman, the gym rats fables perhaps sound more credible than they do for Godfrey or Williams?

 

He shared a ring with the other most overrated HW of all time .
That fight showed both of their shortcomings but seemed to enhance their reputations ( him v Foreman).
I think because the 70's is rated so highly , all the fighters who took part seem to be remembered a little better than they were.
It was an all action era and most of the fights that should have happened, DID happen and mostly at the right time , which set it apart from ( say ) the 90's.
However you can pick holes in it.
Frazier was damaged goods after the FOTC in '71
Foreman didn't kick on after looking unbeatable
Ali was Ali but obviously declined as the decade progressed,
Norton was quality but probably lacked the power to dominate
Holmes was a slow burner who eventually came to prominence after the others faded
The next tier guys were good, including Lyle ,Shavers , Bugner , Young etc but their profile maybe gets a ' leg up ' a notch or two by association with the elite guys who's careers they overlapped with.
Lyle falls into that category.

 

I'm not the biggest fan of Lyle but i'll defend him somewhat he beat a prime Earnie Shavers,and came within a whisker of beating George Foreman. That's two notable performances against two Heavyweights ranked as the top 5 hardest hitting Heavyweights of all time which deserves some respect.

Wins over Ellis, Bonavena, Peralta, early stoppage over Garcia who beat Norton, another early stoppage vs Mathis.

Not an amazing resume but solid enough with two notable performances against top 5 hardest hitting Heavyweights of all time as i said above that's not too shabby.

Is Lyle a H2H monster ? no but he's a good sized Heavyweight with good power, alot of heart, and a solid chin. I think he'd be a top 10 contender in most eras.

 

He was the first real test of Foreman's chin? That's about all I got lol

Similar to how Bowe was a testament to Holyfield's chin, actually Lyle vs Bowe would probably be pretty good

 

He has a story. He overcame adversity (although to all accounts but his own it was adversity of his own making). He spent 7-1/2 years in prison where he barely survived a near-death stabbing. Consequently, he got a late start with his boxing career, but still was able to leave his mark. This makes him an appealing character to a lot of people, especially those who like to fantasize over what might'a, should'a, or could'a been.

 

Seems like he was a pretty good fighter to me.

Where do you see people overrating him and putting him in some kind of ATG elite status?

There’s people here who think Bob Fitzsimmons could wreck top heavyweights of the 1960s and on … at 160 pounds, lol. So what? In H2H matchups (if that’s what we’re talking about, because I guess I’ve missed all the Lyle ATG threads or the praise that the OP is talking about) people have all kinds of opinions … and that’s OK. The public thought Mike Tyson would destroy Buster Douglas and they weren’t right, but if they’d never fought and someone made it as a fantasy fight anyone who picked Douglas would be ridiculed … but who would be right and who would be wrong?

If Lyle came along in the 1980s, I personally think he’d have been third-best behind Larry Holmes and Mike Tyson. He wouldn’t have gone undefeated, but he also wouldn’t have parked himself in front of a buffet or a pile of white powder for half of his prime.

In short, what’s really not to like about him or deserving of a hate thread?

 

For the love of God.

 

Lyle would've done no better (in fact I'd venture he'd do even worse) than Williams against Liston.

Given how laughably inept he looked against Young, he couldn't have dreamed of drawing with Machen either.

 

I think he was a good contender and a tough guy who made the best of what he had. But yeah, much of his reputation is generated from a galant losing effort ( albeit one of the most exciting heavyweight fights of all time. ) At the end of the day however, he beat very few quality fighters

 

They were an inconsistent lot, though, and Lyle turned up in shape, win or lose. I think Berbick has a reasonable shot for that distinction as it is and couldn't Lyle really emulate Berbick's achievements?

 

I imagine he would be a ranked fighter in just about any era, but I cannot imagine him being a champion. He was a solid top 10 fighter. That’s about it.

 

Lyle is probably one of the best examples of a fighter that gets (over)rated based on losing effort(s).

 

I wouldn't bet on Lyle beating Page or Thomas.