If we forget fighters' record and how they look on film and instead focus about what their peers said about them (especially fellow fighters), who stand out? Greb, Langford probably. Who else?
Jeffries. He was seen as unbeatable by the time of his retirement. Joe Gans had infinite respect. Jack Dillon seemed very highly respected.
Do you know what fighters of the time said of Robinson? I haven't seen very much in the way of this. And how about Charles? I've actually seen more said about Burley.
This is a great thread Bokaj - I've always thought personally that this actually a much greater yardstick by which to judge a fighters greatness by myself - the people that really knew just how good these guys were are the fighters themselves who fought them - and their fighting peers from their times - these guys know more about how good these guys were than any 'experts' or 'historians', or even trainers - the people we should really listen to are the fighters themselves that were there in the day and who fought them and who really know what it's like -hopefully people will post all sorts of quotes from the fighters on the fighters - I always love to here them. cheers:good
I've got an interview with Burley in which he said his toughest fights were with Ezzard Charles and Holman Williams but that the best pros he fought were Charles and Moore.
The name of the game is Jack Dempsey. People make him sound invincible, the greatest fighter ever, who hit like a rhino, koing bears with one hand tied behind his back.
I've seen one of his opponents speaking very highly of him. This guy fought Tunney too and said Dempsey was better. Really should remember his name (Fulton?), but don't. Then there's of course a lot of fanciful stuff due to Dempsey's legend. But that I take less seriously.
Definitely not Fred Fulton. Tommy Gibbons? Battling Levinski? Carpentier? LaMotta stated more than once that SRR was tops, and on camera, with Robby sitting beside him. Saoul Mamby's record appears mediocre at first glance, but he was stopped just once in 85 outings, and apparently enjoys enormous respect from fellow professionals of his era. There was little he didn't do by the book, and Holmes hired Mamby on as his trainer during the 1990s. Monzon certainly respected Briscoe, and Carlos was typically seen as coldly contemptuous of his challengers. Although Sharkey always emphatically rated Dempsey over Louis, his expressed racial bias can't be ignored when considering this. Stylish amateur Bob Girard claimed that he knew Marciano was going to be a champion, and self effacingly claimed the only reason he posted a decision over Rocky was because it was scheduled for only three rounds. If he authentically projected that at the time of their match, and not well after the fact of Marciano's professional success, then that's an impressive long range forecast.
Odd that he so badly wanted a fight with someone he himself didn't think he could beat, wouldn't you say?
I like hearing the unusual ones like i remember reading an interview with I think it was Phil Jackson (on Eastside) which centred around his having fought the great Lennox Lewis and they asked him if Lewis was the hardest puncher he'd shared a ring with and he said something like "Hell no, that Dennis Andries. He hit like a mutha******!! I sparred with him and with 16oz gloves he hit harder than anyone I ever fought with 10oz gloves etc etc" - maybe I'll try and find the interview but those are the sort of things nobody would pick up on without listening to the guys who went in there with them - gives you a whole lot of respect for Andries that one (if you didn't already respect him a huge amount already that is). peace
He was fearless, and also a businessman. Dempsey was big money, and Greb himself was prominent enough by 1922 to have his first match with Tunney both filmed and broadcast on Pittsburgh's pioneer KDKA radio. (Not only is the complete absence of Greb competition footage frustrating, but there should also have been a substantial amount of broadcast recordings of his fights by his hometown station. We should know the sound of his voice from post fight interviews as well as be familiar with how he looked when fighting. Yet, nothing, despite the technology in use at the time where he lived and fought so frequently.)
No doubt there was big money for Harry Greb in a Jack Dempsey fight. As for having a chance to beat Jack, I don't give him much hope. I don't think Harry hit hard enough to hurt Jack, but Jack sure could have hurt Harry. Jack could have attacked at will, and, although I think Greb may have had his moments, and may have even occasionally made Jack look foolish, briefly (as he evidently did in some sparring sessions), I don't like his chances against a very aggressive Dempsey in a real championship fight.