Reflecting on PBC and Derrick James...

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by bjl12, Oct 1, 2023.


  1. shadow111

    shadow111 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Ha. You're funny. Light punching Bivol had no effect on Canelo. Putting a dent in a fighter, requires putting a fighter down, or hurting them, that's never happened to Canelo. One thing Canelo did dent in Bivol though was his Bicep. He did the same thing to Callum Smith, both much bigger guys but Canelo was the bull who hits like a freight train. Canelo is known to bust up people's Biceps.
     
  2. Lesion of Doom

    Lesion of Doom Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Your comments make no sense. You do not seem very bright.

    Hayman’s job is to manage his guys not win the fights. That’s on the fighters. And people wanted to criticize him for protecting his clients, but in 2023 his guys have been in tough.

    You should want a promoter to match his best fighters against the toughest opponents. That is what he has done.

    When he was protecting guys, which he was, he deserved criticism.
     
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  3. steviebruno

    steviebruno ESB NYC Delegate banned Full Member

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    Wr already know that Inoue is special. My point was that Fulton is not. The only question to be asked was whether the weight would be too much, and it wasn't. It shouldn't have been, because Fulton does not impose size and had already struggled with lesser fighters.

    Never said that it was unique, just that it was beneficial. Does Canelo look the same at 175?

    I don't need to be in camp to look at him and see that he was in LA Fitness shape. And I don't see how DJ can be blamed for the strategy, unless he told Charlo to fight like a *****.
    We disagree here. A reasonable amount of cutting is an essential and inherent part of any camp. If you eat right and train your hardest over 8-12 weeks, you are going to lose weight and sculpt your body. Only the most disciplined fighters don't need to cut, because they are always near optimal condition. Jermell Charlo isn't that sort of guy in between fights.

    If he'd had time to at least try to make this a real fight, he might have kept right on cutting down to around 160, then bulked back up to 168 with strength training. That did not happen here. It was a spur of the moment cash grab, so he showed up slow, soft, and weak... completely unprepared for the weight jump.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2023
  4. C.J.

    C.J. Boxings Living Legend revered & respected by all Full Member

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    But he got his butt kicked by Dmitry Bivol who took him to school & made him look a fool at times. Even his Vegas judges didn't dare to give him a bogus draw dec although they scored it 115 -13 across the board which was just as ludicrous Ginger hardly won a round lol
     
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  5. bjl12

    bjl12 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    We disagree across the board friend.

    If it was that easy for fighters to move up in weight every fighter would be challenging unified champs in their 4th weight class all the time, but it doesnt happen that way. There's a reason for that.

    Canelo is too small for 175 and might even be small for 168 but the competiton is weak there. Very few people (if any) would take Canelo over SOG, Toney, RJJ, or even Calzaghe. There are a host of other SMW that beat Canelo imho but this generation is kinda weak.

    Derrick James makes the game plan for his fighters. He instructs them to come in heavy, light, strong, fast, etc. His two biggest fights, Spence Crawford and Charlo Canelo, were washes. His fights literally won 2/21 rounds and were KD 4 times. That is horrific preparation.

    When people move up in weight and try to "fill in" theyre already at a disadvantage. Being successful using a more narrow frame can work moving up in weight so long as speed and stamina and output are prioritized. Filling in (or bulking up) on a smaller frame almost never works. Power doesn't always translate and muscle mass inhibits both speed and stamina.

    I made a post a week or so before the fight that I liked Derrick James approach when he said Jermell was going to come in at 163 or 164. That wouldve indicated that Jermell focused more on speed and stamina but it turned out Jermell did whatever he wanted to do and/or Derrick James is nothing more than a puppet.
     
  6. steviebruno

    steviebruno ESB NYC Delegate banned Full Member

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    You just contradicted yourself by blaming DJ's poor gameplan for Charlo looking soft, then saying that Charlo did what he wanted to do and DJ was just a puppet. You lack focus because your argument is based upon your irrelevant anti-PBC agenda.

    If you want to maintain that Stephen Fulton is anything special, we agree to disagree. Weight classes are separated by like 3-4 pounds at the lower weights, so it is much easier for a great fighter like Inoue to move up classes. Fulton was no bigger in the ring and to base his supposed chances on an alleged weight advantage was nonsense.
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2023
  7. Braindamage

    Braindamage Baby Face Beast Full Member

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    His guys lost to arguably the top 3 P4P guys in the world. That being said, he should be a trainer getting guys ready for a fight, not in the corner during a fight. He gives no good instructions and doesn't seem to have a plan B. See Spence/Crawford and Charlo/Canelo fights for good examples
     
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  8. oldcanvasback

    oldcanvasback Active Member Full Member

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    I think an argument can be made that James could've developed Spence more. I'm not sure Spence has done much but 1-1-2 and 4-3 to the body ever.
    PBC guys don't fight enough for skills and tactics to be tested.
     
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  9. Babality

    Babality KTFO!!!!!!! Full Member

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    To be fair, look at the guys they lost too. Literally the absolute best.
     
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  10. Carinito

    Carinito Member Full Member

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    If were talking PBC in general, than you forgot about Fury beating Wilder two times.
     
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  11. Mark Anthony

    Mark Anthony Internet virgin Full Member

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    It`s the way they lost though, they literally looked lost.